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Author Topic: Backup communication for Zero owners  (Read 2208 times)

Richard230

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2018, 04:54:33 AM »

What I want to do is to spend less time in front of my computer, not more time.  I only use my computer for checking the local weather, for visiting three forums that specialize in the motorcycles that I own and for sending email messages to family members and close friends once in a while.  The rest of the time I prefer to be riding, hiking, working in my garden, baking (I am currently baking buttermilk rye bread) and reading real paper books.   :)
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

MostlyBonkers

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2018, 06:40:57 PM »

I think some of what Terry is getting at can be summarised quite nicely by this quote:

If you never change your mind, why have one?
Edward de Bono

I prefer using this forum via Tapatalk versus the Facebook group.  Some of that is force of habit and familiarity.  I have posted on the FB group a number of times, but I do prefer the forum.  It just feels easier to me and I think it is a much better format for discussion.

I'm afraid that Facebook has been the death of many forums. People like convenience and that's what Facebook provides. 

I hope that you manage to encourage people on the Facebook group to join the forum, Terry.  If people get the hang of using the right tool for the right job, then everyone wins. Unfortunately, having two places to visit is too much effort for most people and Facebook has been divisive in this respect.

I think I'll try and keep up with the Facebook group a bit more and direct people to relevant discussions on the forum.  It might not make much difference though.  I can't remember the last time I used Usenet...
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Skidz

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2018, 07:23:52 PM »

Yes, it might have been a few years since using facebook. My wife has it and spends her time browsing it, and I couldn't care less about it. Sorry. If all the sheeple decide to use it for all they can then by all means do so, but I truly dislike the whole facebook concept. Social media my @$$ ;)
As soon as I sign up/in, I get 1-200 friend requests of ppl i couldn't be bothered to keep as friends irl so why be friends online? And just to check if Zero or the community has done something I have to put up with that. Mailbox full of sh*t unless I change settings tucked away somewhere, the EULA telling me I just sold my soul... No thanks.

To each his own. You be happy with your facebook-account. I'll be happy without. And if the community moves to facebook, i'll wave you guys goodbye even ;)
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igorbaldo

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2018, 08:20:39 PM »

Use stuff for what it's designed. Forums to share info and ask questions, facebook for showing off and telling people what you ate. I'm not interested in the latter and have no facebook account and from what I hear around me that gives me a few hours a week extra to go ride the Zero instead of weeding through useless messages.

Agreed!   8)
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JaimeC

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2018, 03:53:22 AM »

I do miss Usenet.  I still use it to track some things (like Mozilla development) but it seems to have pretty much died.  I liked the non-centralized structure.  It got annoying with all the spammers and trolls but it was usually easy enough to set up filters to eliminate most of that crap.

Too many of these "centralized sites" like Facebook and Google+ store WAAY too much information about you to make me feel comfortable.  You can still be completely anonymous on Twitter, but how long will that last with government pressure on all of these companies?  And as we've seen in the news, all of that personal information in one place is just irresistible to certain entities out there.
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domingo3

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2018, 01:15:21 AM »

Cross posted from my reply to Electric Terry's post on Facebook:

  Here's a perfect example of why I prefer the forums! Even though I check FB ZMOG daily and I knew (because you said you would on EMF) that you were going to make this post, I missed it. Today (two days later), I had to scroll down 17 screens to get past 20 posts to find it. On EMF, I can look at one screen and see 20 topics, plus I can click on the handy "new" icon to jump to the next new post in threads that I am actively reading. FB is a fine tool for posting quick questions or showing off pictures, but I think the forums are much better suited for sharing knowledge and more in depth discussions
  Also, the forums don't waste space with irrelevant suggestions, like adding my mother-in-law to ZMOG, joining a drone group, or buying a riding lawn mower on the local marketplace.
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MostlyBonkers

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2018, 03:56:04 AM »

+1
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Richard230

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2018, 04:39:46 AM »

+2
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

domingo3

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #23 on: March 13, 2018, 09:53:46 PM »

  Another trend that I'm noticing on Facebook is a lot of the newbie questions are being asked again and again.  I think the format there is more conducive to people making a quick post looking for an answer rather than searching and reading.
  Rather than repeat the information that's already on the forums, I'm going to start linking to the related thread here.  Some might view that as being obstinate, but I'm hoping that will help people notice the resources here and maybe even contribute.
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2016 Zero FXS 2018 Zero FXS 2016 SR

MostlyBonkers

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2018, 03:07:26 AM »

  Another trend that I'm noticing on Facebook is a lot of the newbie questions are being asked again and again.  I think the format there is more conducive to people making a quick post looking for an answer rather than searching and reading.
  Rather than repeat the information that's already on the forums, I'm going to start linking to the related thread here.  Some might view that as being obstinate, but I'm hoping that will help people notice the resources here and maybe even contribute.


Here's one:


*******
So im confused (which isnt hard sometimes)... I know that the power tank on the 2018 add's 3.6 KWH for a total pack of 18KWH, How much does the charge tank add to the system if any? i though i read that it added 6KWH to the total pack for 20.4 on a 14.4 sr bike?

*******

If you look at all the comments, everyone has been really kind and given up their precious time to answer a question that is just lazy and daft.  I wasn't quite so charitable...  The guy obviously couldn't be bothered to read any information about the accessories at all and thought it was perfectly ok to waste other peoples time instead.
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KrazyEd

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #25 on: March 15, 2018, 03:13:34 AM »

The charge tank doesn't add capacity, just faster charging.
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MostlyBonkers

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #26 on: March 15, 2018, 03:55:59 AM »

The charge tank doesn't add capacity, just faster charging.

Aaarrrrgggghhhh!

I'm going to bed. Today has been too much what with all the morons I have to deal with at work as well...

KrazyEd, you're either too kind or just bloody hilarious!. ;-)
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BrianTRice@gmail.com

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #27 on: March 15, 2018, 12:07:16 PM »

  Another trend that I'm noticing on Facebook is a lot of the newbie questions are being asked again and again.  I think the format there is more conducive to people making a quick post looking for an answer rather than searching and reading.
  Rather than repeat the information that's already on the forums, I'm going to start linking to the related thread here.  Some might view that as being obstinate, but I'm hoping that will help people notice the resources here and maybe even contribute.

I’d appreciate links to the wiki and ideally some help making it easier to find information there. Or at least some priorities to help spend my spare time in a more focused way.
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Current: 2020 DSR, 2012 Suzuki V-Strom
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wavelet

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2018, 02:34:59 PM »

I've been participating in numerous online discussion of specialized in-depth subjects,  work- and hobby-and social-related, for 30 years, long before the existence of the Web.   
Web forums (based on the original Usenet model, before it became commercial) were explicitly designed for this.

Facebook is an extremely bad choice for information sharing on focused subjects, putting aside the fact that many online users boycott it due the crass commercialization and random functional changes. There is no "thread" concept, alerts cannot thus be made thread-specific, or fine-tuned for getting a per-new-post/per-day/per-week alert; searching is nowhere as deterministic; there is no convenient way to "pin" posts so that they are always visible (e.g., FAQs); the UI is designed to always show only an initial small part of a post, so you see lots of posts at the expense of a linear-chronology deeper view. It also shows only a random subset of posts, to force you to interact with the UI. Directly quoting from a senior FB developer some years back, it's intended for "very shallow content to be browsed quickly, not read in-depth, so the viewer stays on page as long as possible. Basically, promote a type of ADHD".

That's not how to best serve the interests of a subject-focused community.

Most Forum software is designed to easily allow various views of the posts, and facilitate full ,multi-criteria binary search ("all posts by user ABC with the words DEF and GHI in the subforum 'aftermarket accessories' in the date range MMM to NNN").

FB doesn't have any Customer Service as such. Whereas the way independent forums are administered varies greatly, depending on the subject and personalities involved, in most cases they are fellow enthusiasts like you, so there's some basis for trying to convince them to change policies or technical matters (size of photos that can be uploaded etc.) You have zero leverage with FB, whose actual policies and reasons for doing anything (like removing a post) aren't transparent, and virtually never explained in detail, and the asymetry between any user or group and FB as a corporate entity is much greater.

There are also potential legal disadvantages:
While FB change their Terms of Service, AFAIK the following still applies: Anything you post publicly may be used or reused by any FB user without permission or royalties -- for example, if you post a design for a neat widget to get feedback, doing so will kill any legal rights you have to get royalties on later use. FB does this because they don't want to be bothered adjudicating between members --  understandable with a couple of billion users.
Most Web forums have a much  friendlier attitude & policy. Many also use unpaid-volunteer peer moderators to help discussion stay on-topic, and maintain reasonable standards of behavior; this is very evident in the enormously better signal-to-noise ratio.

The concern about backups is valid, but frankly, although FB may invest a lot more in IT redundancy, security etc., they're also a huge target for malicious actors, whereas any given forum at most gets the occasional spam wave. It's virtually always not at all difficult for whomever administers the forum to get some good, free advice from forum members who are IT people re how to handle backups and so on.

I can't think of a single advantage of using FB for this type of thing... I certainly won't participate in any such discussions on FB.
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Richard230

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Re: Backup communication for Zero owners
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2018, 08:24:53 PM »

I have been reading monthly motorcycle magazines since I started to subscribe to Cycle World shortly after it was first published in January 1962.  In fact, I still have the February 1962 and other early issues in my motorcycle publication history collection. Unfortunately, both Motorcyclist and Cycle World magazines now seem to be following the Facebook model, except their monthly publications have been reduced to quarterly issues.  But what really irritates me is that they are moving away from reporting on new motorcycles and their technical features, which is why I was reading them in the first place, to stories about motorcycle riders taking trips here and there, that I know nothing about and have no interest in. So I guess I will be allowing my motorcycle subscriptions to these magazines to expire and will be spending even more time on vehicle-specific forums that interest me, where their technical features are discussed more so than someone's personality and where they went to eat and drink while riding their Harley.
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.
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