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Author Topic: SR/F charge adapter blinks red  (Read 596 times)

vinceherman

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SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« on: June 21, 2019, 07:19:28 PM »

Today was my third commute.  The first 2 days, I got to work, plugged in the charge adapter to the wall, observed the blue light on solid with one red blip.  I plugged in the J-1772 and the bike started charging.
All was good.
Today, I plugged the adapter in to the wall and I got the blue and red blinking.  Bummer.
It is a GFI outlet.  I reset it.  I plugged in again and still got the blinking red.  I tried both the top and bottom outlet.  Same result, blinking red.

I walked over to a second outlet and the adapter shows the expected solid blue.
Matt, the building manager checked breakers and nothing was thrown.  He gave me permission to use the parking spot by the other outlet today.  That spot is currently unused but is in the section set aside for building staff rather then tenants where I had hoped to be able to charge.

So, able to charge today, but curious what might make the GFI outlet work 2 days in a row and then fail the third day.
The paperwork for the charge adapter is at home so I cannot check the specific instructions for this condition now.
Any ideas?
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Jarrett

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2019, 08:11:49 PM »

I think you are the first one here actually using a SR/F, meaning this kind of info may be short in supply.
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Jarrett

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2019, 08:12:43 PM »

Looks like you are getting good feedback on ZMOG though.
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GaryArt1

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2019, 08:19:57 PM »

I know GFCI outlets are very temperamental and sensitive especially when they get a little older.  I have replaced numerous around my house and friends.  I have one at my house that every time it gets very humid (not even rainy) and a load is used, it trips.  You have to see if the GFCI is tripping and the indication you have on the bike means it is sensing a cord plugged in but no electricity.  I find it usually can be solved by putting in a new GFCI outlet.  I would recommend that a 20A GFCI is put in to make sure it will cover the draw from the bike.  I have to replace the one I have at my pool now because it seems evertime my pump comes on, heavy load, it trips it.  I have plugged pump into other GFCI and no problem with shorts so it is outlets.  I know they serve a good purpose but I really hate GFCIs.  Now I have it say that I am not a electrician but I used to be in construction and played one at times.
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Currently own: 
2020 Blue Zero SR/F Premium
2005 Suzuki Boulevard C50T

NetPro

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2019, 11:42:40 PM »

I second GaryArt1 comments regarding the lack of reliability with these outlets when they get old.
I too had to replace several of them around the house because high humidity or rain (even nearby lighting would affect them) would mess them up.
Not a single issue after I replaced them a couple of years ago.

I too have an SR/F (got it 3 days ago) and have charged three times using the adapter just like you and so far so good (connected to one of those outlets mentioned above, as a matter of fact).
Also, keep in mind that is very common to have one or more outlets down-stream from a GFCI one, being connected to it, so it that one is acting up, so will the one(s) being fed from this "master" one.

Try and see if the landlord would replace the outlet(s). They are only $15 / 20 a piece if I remember correctly.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 12:16:00 AM by NetPro »
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GaryArt1

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2019, 11:55:43 PM »

Hey Netpro.  Congrats on your new SR/F.  I'm am waiting on mine.  If you do not mind can you tell me when you ordered so I can gauge when mine should be delivered.
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2020 Blue Zero SR/F Premium
2005 Suzuki Boulevard C50T

vinceherman

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2019, 12:59:11 AM »

If you do not mind can you tell me when you ordered so I can gauge when mine should be delivered.
For me, the order was placed the day after the announcement was made.

Try and see if the landlord would replace the outlet(s). They are only $15 / 20 a piece if I remember correctly.
Matt, the building management guy is all on my side.  If the outlet is not working properly, I expect him to take action based on the needs of the building.
Now, that action might be to remove the outlet.  I don't know.
But here really does have interest in helping me. 
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 01:02:57 AM by vinceherman »
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DonTom

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2019, 01:14:43 AM »

Today was my third commute.  The first 2 days, I got to work, plugged in the charge adapter to the wall, observed the blue light on solid with one red blip.  I plugged in the J-1772 and the bike started charging.
All was good.
Today, I plugged the adapter in to the wall and I got the blue and red blinking.  Bummer.
It is a GFI outlet.  I reset it.  I plugged in again and still got the blinking red.  I tried both the top and bottom outlet.  Same result, blinking red.

I walked over to a second outlet and the adapter shows the expected solid blue.
Matt, the building manager checked breakers and nothing was thrown.  He gave me permission to use the parking spot by the other outlet today.  That spot is currently unused but is in the section set aside for building staff rather then tenants where I had hoped to be able to charge.

So, able to charge today, but curious what might make the GFI outlet work 2 days in a row and then fail the third day.
The paperwork for the charge adapter is at home so I cannot check the specific instructions for this condition now.
Any ideas?
Use an adapter that does NOT connect to the ground of the bike. Such as one of these after you break off the ground tap.

-Don-  Cold Springs Valley, NV
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2017 Blk/Gold HD Road Glide Ultra
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2023 Energica Experia LE
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Doug S

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2019, 01:34:34 AM »

Did you hear a click when you plugged in? As in, the GFCI tripped? A GFCI shouldn't be able to affect the bike's charger in any other way -- if it detects a ground fault, it shuts off, but that SHOULD BE the only possible interaction.

If you open up a GFCI, you'll find that (generally) the hot and neutral wires are wrapped together around a ferrite core, forming a "common-mode transformer" with a separate output winding. The output of this transformer is exactly zero if the current in the two leads is identical but opposite, as it will be when there are no ground faults (the current flowing "out of" the circuit will be precisely identical and opposite to the current "into" the circuit if no electrons are leaking anywhere, because electrons can't be either created or destroyed). It's basic physics and pretty much foolproof.

One of the few possibilities I can think of is that maybe the GFCI is wired wrong? Hot and neutral crossed, maybe, or maybe input and output leads confused. But then it doesn't seem like it would have worked the first two times.

Many people have had a mysterious "ground fault" problem with their Zero chargers, and it's never been clear what causes it or how to fix it. Sometimes it seems related to a GFCI, sometimes not. AFAIK it still affects some people and there's no real understanding of the problem. I think this problem is partially responsible for the demise of DigiNow, and I don't think even they ever really got to the bottom of it.

I've wondered if the extra inductance in the power lines caused by the common-mode choke in the GFCI is somehow detected by the charger as a "ground fault". God only knows what they're doing to detect a "ground fault" from that end of the circuit, and what the failure modes could be in their test. Whatever they're doing, it seems to have an inordinate number of false positives.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 01:36:43 AM by Doug S »
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There's no better alarm clock than sunlight on asphalt.

NetPro

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2019, 10:29:51 AM »

Hey Netpro.  Congrats on your new SR/F.  I'm am waiting on mine.  If you do not mind can you tell me when you ordered so I can gauge when mine should be delivered.

See this post from a couple of days ago explaining how I got mine. Pure luck, really.
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=9086.msg78579#msg78579
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vinceherman

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Re: SR/F charge adapter blinks red
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2019, 06:19:11 PM »

Update on the status of the plug
The maintenance guy plugged in a troubleshooter and it reported bad neutral on the GFI outlet.
He has an electrician coming in to fix it.  YAY!
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