ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Other Electric Motorcycles => Topic started by: Richard230 on September 11, 2013, 03:16:52 AM
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BMW has finally introduced their C Evolution electric maxi scooter, after at least three years of development. It looks like a typical BMW product, very fancy, lots of nice features and maybe a little over-engineered. See the photos, watch the video and read about it here:
http://rideapart.com/2013/09/2014-bmw-c-evolution-first-photos-and-specs/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+HellForLeather+%28Hell+For+Leather%29 (http://rideapart.com/2013/09/2014-bmw-c-evolution-first-photos-and-specs/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+HellForLeather+%28Hell+For+Leather%29)
Note the reader comments at the bottom of the page.
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I hope "Ride Apart" ascertain the facts more carefully at the other parts of their articles.
.. while a typical European 220v/12a outlet can charge the battery ...
Europe is different but typical we have 230V and 16A!
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Thanks for posting that Richard. I watched an MCN YouTube clip earlier today where they said it would cost £13,500 in the UK. I wish more subsidies were available so that these could be made cheaper to the consumer than their petrol equivalents. Just imagine the inner city pollution reduction. It would hopefully take some of those ridiculous two strokes off the road too.
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InsideEVs has a nice detailed look at the BMW C Evolution.
http://insideevs.com/detail-bmw-c-evolution-electric-maxi-scooter/ (http://insideevs.com/detail-bmw-c-evolution-electric-maxi-scooter/)
They state the price is 15000 euros in germany. "We still don’t have US pricing from BMW, but this electric scooter will be sold in the States."
Peak power output of 35 kW, 0-100 km/h in 6.2 seconds. This is actually faster than the C600 Sport and C650 GT, at 7.1s and 7.5s respectively. It is slightly heavier, at 265 kg vs 249 kg (C600 Sport) and 261 kg (C650 GT). Both of the gas powered bikes have much higher top speeds, but the Evolution of course will mostly see duty in the city, not on the Autobahn.
C600 Sport: 11.200,00 EUR or 9590 USD
C650 GT: 11.550,00 EUR or 9990 USD
C Evolution: 15.000,00 EUR
Based on these prices, I would expect the C Evolution to be priced right at $13000 when it arrives in the US. This puts it on price parity with the 2014 Zero S ZF8.5, though of course the two are substantially different bikes. The Zero is significantly faster and lighter; the BMW will probably be more comfortable to ride two-up, has a faster charger (3 kW), and of course has the roundel on the front as well as BMW's distribution and service network.
BMW hasn't listed MIC standard range ratings for the C Evolution, but states the range at 100 km / 62 miles in "practical operation". In comparison, Zero states the S ZF8.5 range at 103 miles in the city, 64 miles at constant 55 mph, and 53 miles at constant 70 mph. Zero will probably have the edge in range in all but highway operation.
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My BMW dealer informs me that BMWNA has decided not to offer the C Evolution for sale in the U.S. They don't see a market for it and the cost of importing the bike, training shop technicians and inventorying parts is just too great for the potential sales in North America. Maybe next year, but not this year.
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Wise.. and maybe a little cowardly.
The C Evolution has lower specifications than the $13k Zero S, and (partly due to a limited dealer network) Zero is selling < 1000 units/year, and most of those are probably the larger battery bikes. BMW might sell 1000 units of these per year, overall they sell around 110k units/year (http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/573/17739/Motorcycle-Article/BMW-Achieves-Record-Sales-in-2013.aspx).
BMW may first build a few hundred units, sell them only in Germany, and see how sales are for the first year before making a decision to expand outwards.
This bike is a halo vehicle in a way for BMW; Germany is pivoting heavily towards a renewable energy grid, and this along with the BMW i-series cars are great design exercises for BMW, even if initially they aren't extremely successful. (On the other hand.. BMW is basically sold out of their i3)
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When it comes to new BMW models, the U.S. BMW importer, BMWNA, are real chickens and are all about making money, not about being "green" or making a "statement". They let BMW do that in Europe and if the model flys there, and if they get enough interest in the vehicle from their dealers, only then will they import the model into North America - and that even goes for some new IC models, too. (My daughter owns a German-model 1981 BMW R65LS, which was not imported into the U.S. until 1982, as an example. Also, I once owned a 1997 F650 Funduro single, which was a new model in the U.S. that year, although it had been kicking around Europe since 1993.)
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Mike Werner test rides the BMW scooter: http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/review-electric-bmw-c-evolution-scooter---the-future-now.htm (http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/review-electric-bmw-c-evolution-scooter---the-future-now.htm)
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So the acceleration IS really close to 4 seconds!
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So the acceleration IS really close to 4 seconds!
Not officially. BMW quotes 6, but it feels much faster. My Ducati does 4, and that is what this felt. I didn't use a stopwatch, but counting, so could be off by a second or so. Compared to the Zero, that thing took off like a bat out of hell.
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BMW quotes 6, but it feels much faster. My Ducati does 4, and that is what this felt. I didn't use a stopwatch, but counting, so could be off by a second or so. Compared to the Zero, that thing took off like a bat out of hell.
The Zero SR does 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Bats out of hell are slower. ;)
http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-reviews/zero-motorcycles/2014-zero-sr-ar161215.html (http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-reviews/zero-motorcycles/2014-zero-sr-ar161215.html)
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BMW quotes 6, but it feels much faster. My Ducati does 4, and that is what this felt. I didn't use a stopwatch, but counting, so could be off by a second or so. Compared to the Zero, that thing took off like a bat out of hell.
The Zero SR does 0-60 in 3.3 seconds. Bats out of hell are slower. ;)
http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-reviews/zero-motorcycles/2014-zero-sr-ar161215.html (http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-reviews/zero-motorcycles/2014-zero-sr-ar161215.html)
That one didn't exist last year when I tested the Zero... :)
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I'd asked BMW some question for my article, and finally got some answers (a bit late..).
I'll share them with you..
Maintenance
Initial maintenance after break-in period (1000 km). Then every 10,000 km. Maintenance can only be done by BMW employees for Level 2 maintenance. Level 1 can only be done by dealers if they have had the training and equipment (high electrical tension work). This means the scooters will need to be sent to the central repair hub (for each country).
Battery
The battery certificate is valid for 5 years or 50,000 km (whichever comes first) and the terms and conditions of the warranty approximate very closely to those formulated by BMW i.
70 % of original battery storage capacity is the figure guaranteed.
So there you go. I got from the French dealer a figure: they have 100 scooters for France, and already a lot have been sold. He figures that by the end of the year, all the stock will be gone. The C Evolution is outside the dealer's quota and figures, so they don't really have any incentive to sell.
The leasing deal is pretty sweet. A 3 year lease is proposed, with 0 capital outlay, for €295 per month. 3 years later, you get a new one...(that's about $10.000 for the 3 years, while they are selling them I believe for 15-18.000).
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Here is Mike Werner first report on his new BMW C Evolution Electric scoot:
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/bmw-c-evolution-electric-scooter---warm-welcome-to-my-family.htm (http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/bmw-c-evolution-electric-scooter---warm-welcome-to-my-family.htm)
Looks good Mike! :)
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Great write-up, Mike!
I have an electric scooter too, and am happy to see that you are enjoying yours. It's a beautiful ride that you have there.
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Yeah, after the disappointment of not getting the Zero, and after having review the Beemer, I got very attached to it. Only "issue" is the rock hard saddle, but since it's not a bike to go long distances, it's not really an issue.
Despite the 250 kg weight, it feels very light in the curves. Pick up speed is very, very good. In Eco Pro mode, it leaves from standstill like a 125 cc. But in Dynamic mode, with Traction Control, it's like a 5-600 cc....
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I see that for 2015 the C Evolution will be offered with an optional "comfort" seat. You obviously didn't specify that you wanted a comfortable seat, Mike. ;)
https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/pressDetail.html?title=bmw-motorrad-model-facelift-measures-for-model-year-2015-special-model-k-1300-s-motorsport&outputChannelId=6&id=T0185704EN&left_menu_item=node__6629 (https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/pressDetail.html?title=bmw-motorrad-model-facelift-measures-for-model-year-2015-special-model-k-1300-s-motorsport&outputChannelId=6&id=T0185704EN&left_menu_item=node__6629)
Every BMW that I have owned during the past 20 years had a hard seat supplied from the factory and needed an aftermarket seat if you wanted to ride for more than a couple of hours at a time. Oddly, BMW does offer extra-cost "comfort" seats as an after-sales accessory. I always wondered why they just didn't install the comfort seat on all of their models right from the factory. ::) I could think of a couple of reasons, but if you can't say anything nice........
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yeah, I know, I know. But since teh max range is 100 clicks, getting a comfy seat isn't really an issue. The most I'll be doing is 30 km, and my behind will be able to take that. Once battery tech increases, then it'll become a whole different kettle of fish.
And yes, all my BMWs have had very hard seats, but none as hard as my KTM. That really was made out of granite....
(http://photos.imageevent.com/motorbiker/newspics/stonesaddle.jpg)
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Mike has just published a nice summary of his experiences with his C Evolution after riding the scooter for 500 km:
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/review-bmw-c-evolution-electric-scooter---1st-500-kms.htm (http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/review-bmw-c-evolution-electric-scooter---1st-500-kms.htm)
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Motorbiker.org spills the C Evolution's guts:
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/intermot-2014-what-the-electric-bmw--scooter-looks-like-inside.htm (http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/intermot-2014-what-the-electric-bmw--scooter-looks-like-inside.htm)
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Considered making a new thread or posting in this one, decided to post in this thread (sorry if I'm wrong). Do you guys think the 2017 will get the same battery upgrade as the i3? Maybe the 11kW charger that the i3 is getting too?
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Hi Hansi,
You've resurrected an old topic, which is often a good thing to do. Lots of interesting reading that many might have missed the first time round. So from me, thanks!
More range without adding too much weight is always a good thing. With the improvements in battery technology over the last three years, I'd hope they can up the range to at least 130km or so. In the U.K. it would increase the potential market for London commuters to outside the M25. That's a lot more people who earn lots of money and like to live in the countryside. I see quite a few maxi scooters on my commute. I'm not a big scooter fan, but if I'm honest, a maxi scooter would probably be more practical for my daily commute. That's at least 95% of my time on two wheels. I sometimes miss the extra storage and weather protection that a maxi scooter would give me. However, I wouldn't be able to take it off road at weekends like I've been doing quite a lot with my Zero DS.
As for the charger, the little I've seen of car chargers on YouTube videos has shown me that they are much bigger and heavier than bike chargers. Unless they can repackage the i3 charger somehow, I doubt they'll put it in their scooter. It would be nice though!
Most of all, they need to bring the price of that scooter down considerably to make sales. I'd like BMW to take a leaf out of Tesla's book and provide a more genuine mass market offering. A maxi scooter for the minions, not just the managers! I'm sure they'll never stoop low enough to cater for the pizza delivery riders but I'd like to see more people on a good quality machine.
I haven't looked into the market for Chinese electric scooters available in the UK. I hear they're very popular in China and relatively cheap. If they don't spontaneously combust, they may be worth a look.
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Considered making a new thread or posting in this one, decided to post in this thread (sorry if I'm wrong). Do you guys think the 2017 will get the same battery upgrade as the i3? Maybe the 11kW charger that the i3 is getting too?
Since the "C" is made in the factory where they make the i3, using many of the components, including the batteries, I will not be surprised if at Intermot BMW announce increased performance and range. Also, since the scoot is a hot selling bike in several countries; it makes sense, despite the hefty price tag.
As for purchase price... it's why BMW offer a very interesting lease option here in France. And mine expires next year, just in time for an upgraded model.
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It's good to hear that they are selling well Mike.
I know that creative finance packages make expensive cars and bikes affordable for many on a monthly basis and that is to be applauded for lots of reasons. I've been tempted by them myself. My objection to them is that in the long term, they are the most expensive way to own a vehicle. Essentially, all these Personal Contract Plans, leasing deals and so on are structured so that the customer is paying the depreciation when it is highest, for the first three years. At the end, people have very little or no equity in the vehicle. They are forced to pay a substantial balloon payment to keep the vehicle, or sign up to another three year contract. Most do the latter because the lure of a new vehicle is powerful and they don't have the money. It locks them into a cycle of paying top dollar for the privilege of owning a new vehicle every three years.
That's why I think they're evil. Just like a lot of financial products.
Are you still happy with your current scooter Mike? If you had bought it outright, would you be thinking of buying a new one next year? I know we're talking EV's and things are progressing at a fast pace, which makes it a bit different. However, if the bike is still serving it's purpose, I'm sure there must be at least another five years of use left in it.
I wish I had the discipline to save up and pay cash for everything, but I don't. I do go for vehicle loans though, so at least I own the thing at the end and can enjoy a few years of much cheaper motoring once the payments stop. In theory. Difficult in the bike world though as we like to change bikes often.
I'd love to know others' thoughts on this, even though I may be veering off topic a little.
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Actually, I'm paying €250 per month for 3 years, which doesn't even cover the cost of the bike. That's €9000 for a 15000 bike. So I guess BMW are anticipating a good resale value after the 3 years. Or they are using it for promotional reasons. Either way, it's a great deal.
I was buying a Zero (but at a press price, so real cheap), but felt a nagging concern since it's technology that growing very rapidly making the bike obsolete after 3 years. So it's leasing for me for at least 10 more years.
And yes, I'm very happy with the scoot. My first scoot ever, but it works out great in the city. Once I get more range, I'll get rid of the ICE bike.
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I picked up a copy of the Winter issue of the BMW Motorcycle Magazine (sort of a mouthpiece for BMW in the U.S.) at Barnes and Noble yesterday. The magazine contained a nice photogenic article (starting on page 22) on the BMW C Evolution scooter that will be introduced to the U.S. market (and just about everywhere else in the World) during 2017.
While the article didn't contain anything new that hasn't already been available from BMW propaganda online, it did contain a couple of neat photos of the chassis and belt drive and the instrument display. Note that the entire scooter chassis is built around the battery box and that holds the entire scooter together. I guess owners won't be opening up the battery box very often to see what is in there.
No U.S. price has been released yet, but the author of the article estimates that the price for the scooter will be around $15,000 USD. However, that thing sure looks expensive to build to me and I bet that BMW will be loosing money on everyone that the sell.
Only the new "high power" version with a new 94 Ah battery, projected 100-mile range and an electronically-limited top speed of 80 mph will be sold in the U.S. Recharge time is 4 to 5 hours. The motor's power has been increased from 15 to 26 hp, continuous and is now 48 hp, peak. The scooter will have ABS and "Torque Control Assist" (traction control), along with a reverse feature. A new charging cable is provided that has a thinner diameter than the previous cable and can be plugged into a standard home electrical outlet. The charging cable is stored in the right glove box located at the front of the scooter and plugged into the another compartment located at the left side of the leg-shield. There is no mention of the scooter's weight, but I bet it is not exactly light. Attached is a photo of the battery box and chassis.
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Here is a photo of a picture of the scooter's dash display.
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The other thing to point out is that the bike is built in the Berlin BMW i3/i8 car factory, since the battery comes from the i3.
And the weight of mine, though the "older" model, I think is 250 kgs.
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It is a neat thing, but for that price the lack of CCS support is strange. If it would support CCS I would seriously consider one.