ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: MostlyBonkers on August 27, 2014, 03:25:48 AM
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I hope you've all come across the FullyCharged channel on YouTube by now. This is a recent episode and I found it very interesting:
http://youtu.be/BQpX-9OyEr4
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Excellent!! Thanks for that.
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I've seen this claim before. It's wrong (even if I wish it wasn't).
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Energy/Electricity/Consumption-by-petroleum-refineries#2005 (http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Energy/Electricity/Consumption-by-petroleum-refineries#2005)
UK 5.62 billion kWh (total UK consumption = 348.7 billion kWh in 2005, so oil production uses about 2% of national consumption)
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Energy/Oil/Production#2005 (http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Energy/Oil/Production#2005)
UK 1.86 million bbl/day = 679 million bbl/year
5.62 billion kWh / 679 million bbl = 8.3 kWh per barrel
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=24&t=10 (http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=24&t=10)
U.S. refineries produce about 19 gallons of motor gasoline from one barrel (42 gallons) of crude oil. The remainder of the barrel yields other refined products, such as distillate and residual fuel oils, jet fuel, and petroleum coke. Refinery yields of individual products vary from month to month as refiners focus operations to meet demand for different products and maximize profits.
Assuming UK oil is refined similarly to the US, that's about 0.45 kWh per gallon of gas, ignoring the other products produced by the barrel of oil.
He's off by an order of magnitude, give or take.
Now, he's right that oil production uses a hell of a lot of electricity. If you assume 4 miles per kWh, the 2005 UK refinery electricity consumption would power 22 BILLION miles with an EV.
However, that's still small compared to the gas produced. 679 million bbl * 19 gal gas / bbl * 20 mpg = 260 BILLION miles with gas .. not counting the other half of the barrel that's used for diesel, jet fuel, plastics etc etc.
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Thanks promotech. I'll have to watch the video again. Perhaps they did take the energy used in the other steps from oil field to forecourt into account? I've no doubt that there were some more adept minds behind the calculations than the sum of our friend Robert Llwellyn's grey matter! ;-)
On the other hand, if there is a case of misinformation on our hands here, then I'm sure Robert would be the first to correct it. After all, he's trying to fight the misinformation perpetrated by the oil industry and the general ignorance of the masses. This would do his cause no good.
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It's order of magnitudes, but not the basis. The basis is sound, and never talked about. It costs a lot of fuel to make fuel, while more and more electricity is being made out of renewable energy. So, especially in Europe, electricity os becoming cleaner and cleaner.
When ICE vehicle owners are saying that EVs pollute because of the electricity, then pointing out that gasoline production also requires a lot of juice. Maybe not as much as stated in the video, but a hell of a lot.
Personally I'm looking at getting a solar charger station for my BMW. That puts to end any discussion on polluted electricity.
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I buy my electricity from Good Energy, which only purchases its electricity from renewable sources. However in reality 40% of my electricity is being generated from coal.
I've been considering getting my roof fitted with about 4-6Kw of solar panels, which would help with charging my bike.
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I just signed up with Ecotricity. I've also bought one of those power meters so I can monitor how much electricity we're using at home. I'll look into solar but I won't be able to afford it. :-(
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One thing that the Fully Charged video didn't mention was the amount of electricity needed to pull the oil out of the ground and to transport it to the refinery, by pumping through pipelines (done a lot in the U.S.), or by other means, such as shipping, that use oil for power. Then, of course, there is the issue of raw oil being shipped to the U.S., being refined here and then shipped back to other countries for them to use and distribute the refined product. Not terribly efficient, but I guess the system makes money for the oil companies. ::)
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Mike Werner turned the Fully Charged video into a short article about the subject:
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/video-electric-vehicles-pollute-you-say-have-a-look-at-this.htm (http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/video-electric-vehicles-pollute-you-say-have-a-look-at-this.htm)
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Thanks for letting me/us know Richard.
Mike: I'm glad you found the video useful and I enjoyed reading your article.
I didn't know about motorbiker.org until now. Isn't this sharing stuff idea great!?! :-)
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Thanks for letting me/us know Richard.
Mike: I'm glad you found the video useful and I enjoyed reading your article.
I didn't know about motorbiker.org until now. Isn't this sharing stuff idea great!?! :-)
I did, it was fun!