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[Jarrett]

Does the DSR or Livewire have more range?

[heroto]

Similar. The HD is heavier but more aero. Add a charge tank and the DSR would go farther but be really top heavy.
Very different motos otherwise.

[NEW2elec]

Don't talk about it, be about it.

Let's get the bikes together and ride side by side (no drafting) with similar sized riders and run them until they stop and see.
In the end all that matters is how far the thing can go and there are more factors than just battery size.

Wind screens?  If so OEM only to see what the company offers to it's customers.

So a LW vs a SR with PT and a SRF which really is the closest to a LW and an Energica SS9.  I'll concede that a SS9+ should win easy.

Challenge proposed!
And may the best bike win.

[DonTom]

  I'll concede that a SS9+ should win easy.

I would say it will be a close range by looking at the claimed spcs.  At very slow speeds (20 MPH) , Zeros  can do much better than Zero claims for city (223 miles/360 KM) . At higher speeds, Zero's spec is the same as  Energica + for range (112 miles/180 KM ).

Energica + specs (any model of +)  249 city /400KM) also 112 miles / 180 KM).

IMO, Zero specs are inflated a bit less, so I would bet on the Zero SR with power tank, but I would expect its range to be very close to the Energica +.

-Don-  Auburn, CA

[T.S. Zarathustra]

I finished watching the 4th episode. At least their range is increasing with warmer weather, but, man, what a bunch of made up, unnecessary, senseless, drama. I guess it was too much to ask for nice TV show that about the trip, meeting strangers, seeing beautiful landscapes, (to be fair there is a tiny bit of that) not about the issues of taking a long trip in what is essentially a bunch of electric vehicle prototypes. They could have so easily taken the trip on tried and tested Zeros with support of Teslas.

[MVetter]

Also, for funsies, pay attention to their speedometers when they ride. Look at what speeds they're taking this tip.

[DonTom]

Also, for funsies, pay attention to their speedometers when they ride. Look at what speeds they're taking this t<r>ip.

That will probably be accurate  on a HD LW (or even a Zero). But don't bother to look at the Energica's speedometers. It's almost 10 MPH high at the faster speeds. The worse I have seen.  My Moto Guzzi is the same way, and my TTSE is almost as bad. I assume it's an European thing for them to read way high, perhaps because of all their speed cameras.

BTW, I took a long ride with a guy who has a LW today. We charged up in Colfax after a ride to Forest Hill and down the Iowa Hills to Colfax.  He charged at 14 KW as I was charging at 24 KW on my Energica.

He is an employee at Elcon and that was how we met just a few days ago when I purchased a couple of 3.3 KW chargers for my Zero SR.

-Don-  Auburn, CA

[ultrarnr]

I checked my Ribelle's speedometer today against my GPS. The Ribelle was reading 6-7 MPH faster than the GPS was.

[Richard230]

Also, for funsies, pay attention to their speedometers when they ride. Look at what speeds they're taking this t<r>ip.

That will probably be accurate  on a HD LW (or even a Zero). But don't bother to look at the Energica's speedometers. It's almost 10 MPH high at the faster speeds. The worse I have seen.  My Moto Guzzi is the same way, and my TTSE is almost as bad. I assume it's an European thing for them to read way high, perhaps because of all their speed cameras.

BTW, I took a long ride with a guy who has a LW today. We charged up in Colfax after a ride to Forest Hill and down the Iowa Hills to Colfax.  He charged at 14 KW as I was charging at 24 KW on my Energica.

He is an employee at Elcon and that was how we met just a few days ago when I purchased a couple of 3.3 KW chargers for my Zero SR.

-Don-  Auburn, CA

I too thought that nutty speedometers was a European thing, as both of my BMW's read 8 mph fast, while my Zero and Yamaha are right on the money. Even my Royal Enfield with its cable-driven speedo only reads 3 mph high. But then I discovered that my KTM 390 Duke is also very accurate, showing just 1 mph high. So perhaps it is just a German and Italian response to get more speed out of their bikes with no additional expenditure. 

[DonTom]

I checked my Ribelle's speedometer today against my GPS. The Ribelle was reading 6-7 MPH faster than the GPS was.

It's a percentage thing, if not progressive with speed. IOW, the faster I ride, the higher off it reads on my SS9. Zeros and Harleys are right on. If high, no more than 1 MPH. At least with the stock tires, etc.

-Don-  Auburn, CA

[MVetter]

My point wasn't about the speedometers being accurate or inaccurate. My point was the entire trip was basically done at ~30-40mph. Mind-bogglingly slow and boring. 

And Elcon doesn't make anything; they're just a distributor. Did you pick up some TC units for the Zero? How do you plan on doing the CAN controls?

[DonTom]

My point wasn't about the speedometers being accurate or inaccurate. My point was the entire trip was basically done at ~30-40mph. Mind-bogglingly slow and boring.

I enjoy riding electric motorcycles slow, where possible. I normally take the long slow way as I usually am not in a hurry (retired!).

You may consider the speedometer discussion a thread hijack! And same for the rest of this message.

And Elcon doesn't make anything; they're just a distributor. Did you pick up some TC units for the Zero? How do you plan on doing the CAN controls?

Yeah, I know they just distribute (and program) EV chargers.  Mine are simple, they simply turn off (or very close to off) at ~114 VDC . That's around 95% SOC, the OBC can take over from there, if I want that last 5%.  I discovered my Elcons will still charge up  to 100%, but that is if I  have all night to wait for the last few %, as then the charge rate  is about 150 watts if I don't run the OBC.

Up to 90% SOC or so, it is mostly around 6.6 KW charging with the two Elcon 3.3KW chargers running alone, no CANBUS connection.

BTW, I also own two Elcon PF2500's. Those had the CANBUS connection option available  back then, but I wasn't concerned of  the better charging near the end, and they have worked out very well for me. I will now use those on my DS.

BTW, they mentioned DigiNow and how you guys did your own canbus programming somehow. Or somebody did it for you, but Elcon didn't do it on those units, I was told.

I think the new chargers I have are the same ones you used(<Item Code UHF 3300> 3.3 kw, UHF 132-32 HKC-L13800-114v32A 8/10/20/66.67 AH) just mine require no CANBUS connection but won't charge to full.

The two chargers cost me $1,330.00 ($650.00 each). Much better deal than the DeltaQ's. I am very happy with all four of them.

I have been using their two 2.5 KW units for more than a year with no issue. With the new units & OBC running, they exceed the power of most J-stations. So I did this modification to switch in and out the OBC as required. The 2.5 KW units are no longer made. They are the same ones Hollywood Electric used to sell, but programed a bit differently so there is no need for the CANBUS connection.

As I am sure you know, the newer 3.3 KW units are smaller, lighter, more efficient and more power than the 2.5 KW units.

-Don- Auburn, CA

[MVetter]

BTW, they mentioned DigiNow and how you guys did your own canbus programming somehow. Or somebody did it for you, but Elcon didn't do it on those units, I was told.

ahahahahhahahahaha

Elcon doesn't do *anything*

[DonTom]

Elcon doesn't do *anything*

Well, they programmed mine for 114 VDC max  so you cannot say they don't do "anything".  Perhaps takes them a full two or three  minutes or so.

-Don-  Auburn, CA

Elcon doesn't do *anything*

Did Sayyed work there when you were dealing with Elcon?  He is the guy who programs up the chargers at Elcon.

*moderator note: merged posts. keep it on topic or the thread will be locked.

[oobflyer]

I’ve watched all of the four episodes streamed so far. I’m totally disappointed.
Clearly they never talked to ANYONE with any electric motorcycle experience whatsoever. It’s sooo embarrassing.
As a rider of four different electric bikes (so far) it’s clear to me that kWh rating of the battery pack wins the range race every time - except perhaps for the extreme aerodynamic ‘dustbin’ fairings.
The HD-Livewire battery is rated at 15.5 kWh, the Zero DSR, with PowerTank is 18 kWh. (The DSR is the bike that the show casually dismissed as impractical at “70 miles of range” - how about a defamation law-suit Zero?). The Livewire bikes on this TV show are not modified for aerodynamics, that I can see.
As mentioned above - I’m sure that Harley paid $$ and probably also donated the bikes to get the publicity. The only advantage of Harley over the Zero is the CCS charging, but as we see in the first four episodes - they never use this feature - charging only at Level I or Level II charging (and from a diesel generator!)
Why don’t we see an attempt to charge at someone’s house (clothes-drier outlet?) or at an RV campground (30A or 50A)?
If they had hired Terry Hershner, or BenSwing Rich as consultants - this show would have been sooo much better.
At the beginning of ‘Long Way Up’ they mentioned a couple of times that “no one has ever attempted a ride like this before”  - really?
What about Tom Tomczyk? Didn’t he do this ride five years ago?

By the way - I have no bias against Harley - I hope I don’t sound like I do - the Livewire is an awesome bike - I just wish this show had done some fact-checking before starting.