ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: benswing on February 21, 2016, 12:06:40 AM
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Just received this message today! Contact Tony Williams if you are interested in having Zero approved CHAdeMO for your motorcycle:
All,
We have entered into an agreement with Zero Motorcycle to provide our JdeMO equipment for high speed DC charging using public CHAdeMO stations. This will likely be sold through the Zero website and possibly through our website also.
There are now over 10,000 of these stations in the world, with over 2000 of the United States and almost 3000 in Europe.
Zero has provided us with the technical details required to make our equipment work with their motorcycle, but we have not yet begun development work.
The problems with any motorcycle that has just slightly over 100 V maximum means that it will never work with every single station, but it will work with an overwhelming majority. While the specification requires 50 to 500 volt compatibility, unfortunately not every charger manufacturer follows the rules.
We've already successfully tested our equipment on the Lightning motorcycle. You can expect to see Lightning motorcycles with a CHAdeMO port in the very near future.
We also just completed our first prototype on the Tesla Roadster, and we will be delivering JdeMO kits this summer.
We have delivered over 50 units for the Toyota RAV4 EV with another 50 on order.
Here's what I need from each of you; please have your friends and colleagues with a Zero motorcycles who may be interested in such a kit to send us their email to:
JdeMO@QuickChargePower.com
Tony Williams
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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This is great news, especially with cooperation from Zero.
Their existing products show that this is not much of a stretch at all: http://shop.quickchargepower.com/Fast-Charging_c5.htm (http://shop.quickchargepower.com/Fast-Charging_c5.htm)
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That's an interesting development! I've emailed and must check out my local chargers. Let's hope the price is right.
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This is great news, CHAdeMO for Zero was a great idea and should have continued to been sold with the awareness and recommendation of the stations that did work with Zero. CHAdeMO should have policed and shamed/prohibited companies that did not comply with their standards.
I add my email even though i dont have a zero yet, DC fast charging is just so logical and the future of EV charging.
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Great news! Thanks Ben!
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Oh man this came out literary on the day that my bike got the install, not sure how I feel about it...
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Ben, You beat me to it! I asked Tony if I could post here and he said you already had. I had a CHAdaMO system on order from Zero for over six months before they canceled my order. I understand it may not work everywhere but the Elcons don't work everywhere either. It is just part of the risk of riding electric. I hope Tony starts work soon!
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Ok so CHAdeMO is DC fast charging which is what the battery needs to recharge anyway. Like a feeding tube that gives your body the nutrients it needs without having to chew food up and break it down in your guts. Bypass the middleman of AC/DC conversion. So what does that translate to in charge times in the real world? I'll use the newest 13 kWh SR (no power tank) what would the charge time be 0-full?
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Based on my experience with my Leaf, probably about 15 minutes to get close to 100% for a 13kWh battery. I'm told it slows as it gets closer to 100%. I've never CHAdeMO'd past about 90% so I've never seen that for myself. The Leaf is 24kWh and I've always just charged enough to make up my deficit. I do 95% of my charging overnight at home. There are enough quick chargers around now that I'm contemplating attempting a short road trip that would require one.
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So what does that translate to in charge times in the real world? I'll use the newest 13 kWh SR (no power tank) what would the charge time be 0-full?
Charge times vary due to state of charge of your battery. When it is nearly full, the CHAdeMO charger will slow down to protect the battery.
Also, our bikes can't charge as fast as a LEAF because our batteries have a limit of 1C rate of charge, meaning there is a theoretical limit of 1hr being the fastest time to charge fully.
The most useful way to use CHAdeMO is from 20-80% it will take about 35-40 minutes.
Another big benefit is that no extra gear will be required to carry on a rack. You should be able to utilize all of your luggage space.
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Alan unfortunately it won't be 15 minutes. Trouble is the stations are limited to 125 amps output at the desired voltage. At 400 volts that would be 50 kW or enough to do a 13 kWh battery in 15 minutes, but at 100 volts, it will take an hour. And if you have a power tank, even longer. If the cell manufacturer will approve 2C charging, or even 3C charging from 0-50% SOC and then 2C charging to 80% and 1C to full (they already should do this as the cells are plenty capable, they just give it a stamp of 1C all the way to 100% now which is silly, they should trust that their customers can taper the amperage according to their formula and keep the cell temperature below 45C or so while charging) we could charge faster if and when CHAdeMO goes to 200 amps. It's coming eventually, but all the stations already deployed and deployed in the next two years will be stuck at 125 amps.
What we really need is to series at least half the cells for DC charging purposes. So we could charge at 200 volts instead of 100. That would be 25 kW charging where right now we are stuck at 12.5 kW. From a guy who likes to charge at 24 kW or higher from 4 J1772 plugs at the same time, 12.5 kW is like.."meh, if I have to I guess"
Charging is the biggest area to gain with mass adoption of electric vehicles. All the car manufacturers are working on 30 minute charge times. Let's hope Zero has a plan somewhere down the line to fully charge in 30 minutes or perhaps even less in the future as well.
Once the charging technology is there, it would be rather simple to tell Farasis they want to switch from the most energy dense cell possible, to sacrifice 5-10% of range, and switch to an extremely power dense cell chemistry that can charge at 5C standard. The Enerdell cells going in the new Corbin sparrow II have a 5C standard charge rate. (12 minutes for a full charge!)
This would be much better for us! I'd much rather have 180 miles city range instead of 200 if it meant that I could refill that 180 miles range in 12 minutes vs 1 hour. Or more likely would be I'd rather have 90 miles highway range versus 100 miles highway if I could stop for 12 minutes every 90 miles to pee and grab a drink of water and to keep going. I hope this makes logical sense to anyone reading this.
Let's just hope the smartest guys making the future decisions at Zero (sometimes I feel like that is the invus investors versus people that actually ride the motorcycles very far distances and can see the real issues) can imagine riding as many miles as I have and seeing the future like I do. I can't promise, but I'm pretty sure I see the correct future on this one and where we are eventually headed. ;)
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Thanks Ben, this opens up some options...
I'll be seriously investigating this.
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Tony (a great guy) put JdeMO in my RAV4 EV. I was lucky and got Serial Number 1 because he lives only 3 miles from me. Perhaps I can get SN 1 for my DSR?
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Charging is the biggest area to gain with mass adoption of electric vehicles. All the car manufacturers are working on 30 minute charge times. Let's hope Zero has a plan somewhere down the line to fully charge in 30 minutes or perhaps even less in the future as well.
Word. Tesla seems to be doing a lot to try to push this forward, but charging is still probably the biggest aspect of electric vehicles that can improve.
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BTW, I recently heard from Zero who said that they do not currently have plans to offer this device on their website. They have met with Tony Williams at QuickCharge Power a couple of times, but this is not a "Zero approved" product, it is from a 3rd party.
Regardless, QuickCharge Power has an excellent reputation in the EV community, as evidenced by vkruger's comment, and I expect this to be a high quality product. They will not comment on price at this time, but a quick search for Jdemo will find that a fully functional Jdemo unit for RAV4 costs $3,000, and the CHAdeMO inlet alone costs $800.
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Eh, give me the DigiNow charger any day.
I mean seriously, give me one, any day now! C'mon guys, the rest of the world is catching up!
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What if diginow charger had a chademo accessory, then the charger could act as a simple cc-inverter and make available every chademo station in addition to all L2 ac station?
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What if diginow charger had a chademo accessory, then the charger could act as a simple cc-inverter and make available every chademo station in addition to all L2 ac station?
Thats pretty much my idea. With a large enough charger, you can feed it high voltage DC as well, That way you can charge fast, even if the chademo station didnt support the low voltage. The key is the onboard charger has to be large enough to make it worth it.
Sure its not as efficient, but its not horrible either.
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What if diginow charger had a chademo accessory, then the charger could act as a simple cc-inverter and make available every chademo station in addition to all L2 ac station?
Brandon says that the CHAdeMO input isn't going to be released with the first wave, but it will follow shortly. Honestly I don't care all that much -- looking at PlugShare, I'll probably just use the huge number of 14-50 outlets available in my area.
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What if diginow charger had a chademo accessory, then the charger could act as a simple cc-inverter and make available every chademo station in addition to all L2 ac station?
Brandon says that the CHAdeMO input isn't going to be released with the first wave, but it will follow shortly. Honestly I don't care all that much -- looking at PlugShare, I'll probably just use the huge number of 14-50 outlets available in my area.
I've heard the same, and am also mainly banking on RV park coverage. CHAdeMO would be a nice complement to that, however.
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Also, CCS chargers will soon be an important part of charging since they are backed by BMW, Chevy and some other heavy hitters. It is likely that CCS will eventually win out over CHAdeMO in the US, but that won't be an issue for a few years.
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CCS already makes up 25% of installed UK rapid connectors.
(Linky to the ever excellent ZapMap)
https://www.zap-map.com/statistics/#charger-type (https://www.zap-map.com/statistics/#charger-type)
Though a large number of our rapid chargers (especially the Ecotricity ones) are dual CCS / CHAdeMO units.
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Just received this message today! Contact Tony Williams if you are interested in having Zero approved CHAdeMO for your motorcycle:
All,
We have entered into an agreement with Zero Motorcycle to provide our JdeMO equipment for high speed DC charging using public CHAdeMO stations. This will likely be sold through the Zero website and possibly through our website also.
There are now over 10,000 of these stations in the world, with over 2000 of the United States and almost 3000 in Europe.
Zero has provided us with the technical details required to make our equipment work with their motorcycle, but we have not yet begun development work.
The problems with any motorcycle that has just slightly over 100 V maximum means that it will never work with every single station, but it will work with an overwhelming majority. While the specification requires 50 to 500 volt compatibility, unfortunately not every charger manufacturer follows the rules.
We've already successfully tested our equipment on the Lightning motorcycle. You can expect to see Lightning motorcycles with a CHAdeMO port in the very near future.
We also just completed our first prototype on the Tesla Roadster, and we will be delivering JdeMO kits this summer.
We have delivered over 50 units for the Toyota RAV4 EV with another 50 on order.
Here's what I need from each of you; please have your friends and colleagues with a Zero motorcycles who may be interested in such a kit to send us their email to:
JdeMO@QuickChargePower.com
Tony Williams
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Tony W, what happened? Email address bounces, no further word!? And then you fighting with Diginow?
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Tony W, what happened? Email address bounces, no further word!? And then you fighting with Diginow?
No idea, but I'd try phoning/emailing his EV accessory company, Quick Charge Power (https://www.quickchargepower.com/contact) ; the contact page still mentions him.
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Tony (a great guy) put JdeMO in my RAV4 EV. I was lucky and got Serial Number 1 because he lives only 3 miles from me. Perhaps I can get SN 1 for my DSR?
Any luck?
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Just noticed that this is an OLD thread resurrected. I tried going to the website and Firefox threw up a warning page that the site was a potential security risk. Not willing to chance it.
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Just noticed that this is an OLD thread resurrected. I tried going to the website and Firefox threw up a warning page that the site was a potential security risk. Not willing to chance it.
I think this is the correct URL to the website: https://qccharge.com/
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Oh good grief. Not only did Tony Williams ghost the product, he lost the domain too?