ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: Joar79 on March 24, 2015, 06:26:20 PM
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I got my Zero SR 2014 mod a month back. And I absolutely LOVE the bike. I have been waiting and looking for it for over half a year now. And my only issue have really been the range fear. Running out of power. And with a range of 170km with powerpack the only think that stops me from taking it for longer touring rides is a fast charger like CHAdeMO. And I have been questioning everyone. And sadly, Zero Motorcycles have been the quietest ones regarding this. ABB witch deliver the CHAdeMO fast chargers here in Norway (EU) they tell me they have spoken with Zero and tested the motorcycles and everything should be fine. Their fast chargers go as low as 50volts. But in the dialog with the CHAdeMO association. I found out that Zero Motorcycles are no longer a member of the CHAdeMO association. Witch saddens me a lot. I would so like to know what plans they have now. And since I know the CHAdeMO fast charger works here in Norway, I would love to buy one sett anyway. But my Zero dealer says they can get any since Zero Motorcycles do not deliver them anymore. Even tho they are still on their web page.
http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=162 (http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=162)
Mail from CHAdeMO association :
Dear Mr. Joar,
Thank you for your interest in CHAdeMO.
First of all, CHAdeMO protocol is the same wherever you go in the world. However, that does not mean the motorcycles bought elsewhere would work well with all chargers in Europe, for example.
For CHAdeMO chargers meeting all requirements for the full voltage range (50V-500V), your Zero Motorcycle should be able to charge.
However, certain CHAdeMO chargers go from 250V-500V, complying with the SAE requirement of 250V lower voltage bracket, and you would have to ask the charger manufacturers you intend to use beforehand whether their chargers can go as low as 50V (or not).
It is our regret to inform you that Zero Motorcycle is no longer our member, and I suggest you continue to ask them regarding their future plans to deliver CHAdeMO inlets for their motorcycles.
Best regards,
Tomoko
--
Secretariat
CHAdeMO Association Europe
I want a CHAdeMO charger for my Zero SR.
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Because of the compatibility issues (some chargers will not work with the lower voltage of Zero's battery), Zero might have chosen to stop supporting CHAdeMO. I suspect there is too much potential for customer dissatisfaction in this area, if owners get the CHAdeMO and station incompatibility could leave them stranded. This is unfortunate, since a DC quick charge option like CHAdeMO is preferred, since you don't need to haul heavy chargers with you on the bike, and it doesn't care about the country's AC voltages. Here in the US, most infrastructure being built is L2 J1772 chargers, so many Zero owners mount extra AC-DC chargers onto their bikes with a J1772 input.
Have you tried contacting Zero to ask about the CHAdeMO option?
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The consensus is that although Zero has done what they can with Chademo the vast majority of charging stations are NOT compatible. This is because of the voltage that the Zero motorcycle require and although it is part of the Chademo charging standards most choose to not incorporated into their stations because they are focused more on cars.
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3637.0 (http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3637.0)
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3308.msg18982#msg18982 (http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3308.msg18982#msg18982)
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I, too, was disappointed to see that Zero dropped the fast-DC charging idea.
with a range of 170km with powerpack
Isn't it 170 miles ?
I just ordered a second 'Quic' Charger and Y-adaptor from Zero (through my dealership) - so I'll be able to charge at 3.4 kW from a J1772 car-charging station. It's nothing like CHAdeMO, but much better than just charging with the onboard charger. I should be able to charge in 2-3 hours, vs. 10 hours. I'll be testing it as soon as I can.
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And since I know the CHAdeMO fast charger works here in Norway, I would love to buy one sett anyway. But my Zero dealer says they can get any since Zero Motorcycles do not deliver them anymore. Even tho they are still on their web page.
http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=162 (http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=162)
Apparently Zero just took ChaDeMo chargers off their webpage, this link no longer goes to the charger.
Also, with the powertank the city range of an SR is 170 miles. Highway range is closer to 170km, though.
I would also like ChaDeMo and know there are charging stations near me that work with our voltages on the east coast of the U.S.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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The consensus is that although Zero has done what they can with Chademo the vast majority of charging stations are NOT compatible. This is because of the voltage that the Zero motorcycle require and although it is part of the Chademo charging standards most choose to not incorporated into their stations because they are focused more on cars.
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3637.0 (http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3637.0)
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3308.msg18982#msg18982 (http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3308.msg18982#msg18982)
I was never given the impression that "the vast majority of charging stations" was not compatible through any of my reading on this forum, nor in communication with Zero. The problem as I see it has always been a concern for an inconsistent experience for users that reflects badly on Zero. Meaning: even if 10% of the chargers are incompatible, it will cause problems for us, in various ways. I guess Zero decided to go in a different direction after seeing no way of getting satisfaction on this issue from those that choose not to properly implement the CHAdeMO protocol and yet choose to still call their chargers CHAdeMO.
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I have 2 questions on this. Is it possible to put a chademo plug on a 2015 SR? What is the charge time for something like this?
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CHAdeMO fast charging has never been offered for 2015 models and it will not be offered.
I have heard an employee at zero say that he thought 80% of CHAdeMO fast charging stations do not work with their equipment. This may have been an exaggeration, but it seems they feel like they have been burned by offering an expensive product that doesn't work consistently through no fault of their own (namely the voltage issue).
They actually have stopped selling CHAdeMO and have never shipped a CHAdeMO unit for any 2014 bikes. I ordered one and after a month and a half of waiting they pulled the plug on it and will not fill the order, so I'll get my money back. Pretty pissed about that. I don't want money, I want fast charging! Particularly since I got a 2014 model instead of a 2015 specifically to get the CHAdeMO fast charging!
My dream bike was a 2014 Zero SR w/ a power tank and CHAdeMO, which really would have been a road-trip machine!
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I understand that it's not offered by Zero and that not all stations will charge it but my question is, is it possible to make something work whether it
is aftermarket or something put together from parts?
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@zero, if the chademo chargers won't give you 96-118vdc, can you maybe drop 250vdc to 96-118vdc????????? http://www.absopulse.com/Absopulse_DC_DC_Converters.php (http://www.absopulse.com/Absopulse_DC_DC_Converters.php)
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I had a CHAdeMO kit for my Zero SR on order for over seven months before being told recently that Zero wasn't going to deliver it. CHAdeMO systems are being installed all over North Carolina and I could easily travel throughout most of the state using mainly CHAdeMO instead of L2 chargers. I could also travel up the east coast to visit Benswing in NJ and only need to use L2 chargers about three times, the rest all CHAdeMO. And the CHAdeMO systems I would be using are Eaton and Nissan. These are systems that Zero feels good about working with the Zero system. Most of the CHAdeMO systems on the east coast are actually systems that would work with the Zero. But Zero can't see past what they have in California. The models of CHAdeMO chargers around Santa Cruz California are not representative of the rest of the country. So for those of us who could have made good use of the Zero CHAdeMO system we get screwed. One of my concerns right now is that Zero is going to apply the logic they used to kill CHAdeMO to Level 2 charging and as a result we will never see L2 charging on a Zero. Those of us using Elcons know you can't charge at a GE Wattstation because of the required interface needed with the BMS. PEP chargers are the same way. But there are plenty of other systems out there that do work with the Elcons so you just look on Plugshare to make sure before you go to a location to plug in. In the same way with CHAdeMO you would check to see what brand is at the location you want to charge at.
Below is an email from 1 August 2014 that Aaron sent to my dealer and was forwarded to me.
Hi Tanner,
I am glad we finally connected via phone. I thought I would send a quick email for your reference based on our conversation.
The 2014 Zero SR CHAdeMO kit has not been released by engineering. I believe we are only a few weeks away, but I wouldn't be able to ship immediately.
You asked about compatibility with an Eaton Charging Station. Unfortunately, we have limited access to this brand and have not been able to perform thorough compatibility testing. Our tests with the two systems in California were successful, but your customer may want to contact Eaton about this specific charge station to be sure. The specific questions that should be directed toward Eaton are whether they implemented the full CHAdeMO specification and support voltages as low as 50V.
In general, we have not been able to provide an official compatibility list because there is no central testing location or methodology offered by the CHAdeMO group to ensure it. We have found incompatibilities with stations that we believe have not fully implemented the CHAdeMO specification. Usually, these related to a lack of support for voltages around 100v, which our motorcycles require, or Isolation Tests. And a specific brand of station can differ by model or even firmware revision. From our testing, we generally feel good about ABB, Fuji and Nissan stations, but Blink typically doesn't support the lower voltages. AeroVironment may be working on a firmware improvement that will help, but they have not announced a release date.
We all know that the right answer is CHAdeMO should work in every case. For this reason, I am continuing to work with the CHAdeMO organization to ensure that this is the goal. And we believe that when charging station companies comply with the full specification, then our solution will work. But because the market isn't there yet, our CHAdeMO solution today tends to be best for fleet customers willing to install a known compatible charging station. I am happy to speak directly to the end customer about this if it helps support your business.
Regards,
Aaron Cheatham
Director of Customer Experience
Zero Motorcycles
@aaronzeromoto
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Yeah, as of 08/2014, that was the same message I was getting from Chris at Zero. Even as of November 2014, there was no decision to discontinue CHAdeMO support for the '14s, only the decision not to implement the kit for the '15s. This change is new. I want to get an answer from Richard before making any judgements at this point.
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Chademo cost about 1800$ and is limited to very few charge station
And ... the ChaDemo would charge to max 100A but probably 80A on most charge stations so it would be max 8kW
The only advantage of the chademo is that it does not require any onboard or transported charger on the Zero...
A 6kW " portable" Elcon charger cost 1700$ but have the size of two box of shoes side by side. It would require a J1772 adapter for about 150$... total 1860$... and can be used to 99% of the EV charge stations witch are level II 30A J1772 type.
A 7KW DIY VERY COMPACT charger would cost about 300 to 1200$ and is made from server power supply and is not waterproof.
The DIY 7kW charger require a minimum of electronic knowledge to build and a particular attention to operate.
From these evidence i can't see any need for a ChaDeMo except if you can't make the compromise to bring about between 10 to 20 pounds with you on the bike.
How much would you guys be welling to pay to get a J1772 6-7kW portale compact charger for your Zero?
Doc
Doc
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I would definitely pay for charging support that I can use conveniently.
I'll say this about waterproofing support: it makes the difference between occupying precious cargo space versus an exposed area (like the tank bin) where mass and space would not otherwise be used in less-than-ideal weather. 10-20 pounds in a side case is far less convenient than 10-20 pounds over the center of the bike.
Maybe the cargo space limit will be addressed by an aerodynamic touring cowling, or maybe not. But as long as cargo space is at a premium, it's difficult to justify hauling around a charger in its own sealed case.
I ride a lot in the rain, anyway [in Seattle], so carrying high-power electronics that are not waterproofed is scary and likely going to fail at some point.
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Chademo cost about 1800$ and is limited to very few charge station
And ... the ChaDemo would charge to max 100A but probably 80A on most charge stations so it would be max 8kW
The only advantage of the chademo is that it does not require any onboard or transported charger on the Zero...
A 6kW " portable" Elcon charger cost 1700$ but have the size of two box of shoes side by side. It would require a J1772 adapter for about 150$... total 1860$... and can be used to 99% of the EV charge stations witch are level II 30A J1772 type.
A 7KW DIY VERY COMPACT charger would cost about 300 to 1200$ and is made from server power supply and is not waterproof.
The DIY 7kW charger require a minimum of electronic knowledge to build and a particular attention to operate.
From these evidence i can't see any need for a ChaDeMo except if you can't make the compromise to bring about between 10 to 20 pounds with you on the bike.
How much would you guys be welling to pay to get a J1772 6-7kW portale compact charger for your Zero?
Doc
Doc
I was thinking that two ESP120s hacked to allow for a broader DC voltage range wrapped in exhaust pipes would make quite a bit of sense. I have sent an e-mail to a custom exhaust shop about the notion of encasing a single ESP120 in an exhaust pipe with the baffles removed so as to provide camouflage and environmental protection. There would be symmetry, hanging one on each side of the motorcycle. If anything, the bikes would look less conspicuous as they would have the outward appearance differences reduced. I wanted to use the knowledge obtained from the endless sphere hacking of ESP120 + the modular cable componentry demonstrated in Burton's videos to do this. There's still a lot of thinking, designing, and fitting to go on. My end goal is to have something intrinsic to the bike enough that it's not apparent that it could be stolen easily, but would still be removable in the span of a few minutes. Also, it has to look like it belongs on the bike. Also, it has to ultimately be possible to get it UL-certified so insurance problems might be mitigated for users. Also, it should work with J1772 inlets as well as NEMA 14-50 and the others, each plug should be kept as small as possible and modular. The ESP120 should also be considered to be swappable, as they have the functionality to be swappable already designed in, so the exhaust pipe should allow for instant removal of the ESP120 should it fail, so there should be rail guides and a backplane board at the front end of the exhaust pipe it lives in that would then be connected to AC and DC power. The fans face outward and upward, and are only in operation when the bike is stationary, covered most of the time, only uncovered when the chargers are active.
As to CHAdeMO, I can see it becoming more and more common over time. By having force of numbers, we can encourage more adoption of this technology. I think Zero was on the right track but they gave up due to understandable reasons, but they made promises to people and backed out on them without providing a proper alternative on their own and that's a grave mistake.
Oh, and $1200 or so seems to be a number I'd be comfortable with, $1800 would be the upper range and >$2000 is where it'd start to become problematic.
Sorry for the wall of text.
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Additionally, such exhaust cans could be used for storage when the charging is not needed, with a storage "sleeve" to protect the backplane connections. In any such situation, having some sort of minimal locking, like an ace key cabinet lock on the back/top of each can where the ESP120's outward air would be allowed to flow would make sense. There would have to be slits toward the front to allow for inward air flow, but these would have to be protected from weather somehow. I'd imagine that the ESP120 is not safe for any environmental exposure AT ALL.
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The 2014 Zero SR CHAdeMO kit has not been released by engineering. I believe we are only a few weeks away, but I wouldn't be able to ship immediately.
You asked about compatibility with an Eaton Charging Station. Unfortunately, we have limited access to this brand and have not been able to perform thorough compatibility testing. Our tests with the two systems in California were successful, but your customer may want to contact Eaton about this specific charge station to be sure. The specific questions that should be directed toward Eaton are whether they implemented the full CHAdeMO specification and support voltages as low as 50V.
Regards,
Aaron Cheatham
Director of Customer Experience
Zero Motorcycles
@aaronzeromoto
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I have talked to ABB ABB Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABB_Group) witch delivers all the CHAdeMO charging stations here in Norway, they have been in contact with Zero and tested the CHAdeMO charger on the bikes with no issues. ABB also told me that all their chargers around where I live support 50volts. So they say it will not be any issues for me if I get a CHAdeMO for my Zero SR. I think that ABB delivers most of the chargers here in Europe. So if not all, most of the stations will support 50volts.
ultrarnr, does this mean that there will be a CHAdeMO set for the Zero SR 2014 ? If I only could get me a set I would not think a minute about buying one. Is there anyone who can get me a set for my Zero SR 2014?
I WANT ONE! :'( Please Zero!
Best regards
Joar
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Joar,
A CHAdeMO kit for a Zero is a dead issue at this point. I talked with Zero about two weeks ago on it. I think a big part of the problem is Zero engineers who don't realize the world is a lot larger than the state of California. If you look on Plugshare around Santa Cruz you will see a lot of CHAdeMO systems that are not going to work with a Zero. But that is a very poor representation of what the rest of the CHAdeMO landscape looks like. I live in North Carolina and nearly all of the CHAdeMO systems would work with the Zero but again Zero can't see past the state of California.
I think the larger concern right now is whether or not Zero will ever come out with L2 charging. For those of us with Elcons know that some L2 systems do not work because of needed BMS interface. GE Wattstations and PEP stations are examples. Also not every L2 station charges at 6.6Kw. Some go much lower so this is an issue for those who go with a single charger unless you can dial down the power. If you take the logic that Zero applied to the CHAdeMO systems and apply it to L2 charging I don't think Zero will ever go beyond L1 charging. Very sad.
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But have they not made any CHAdeMO sets for the Zero? Someone must have one?
We now have 1500 CHAdeMO chargers here in Europe. Its everywhere. And even Tesla have now approved and made their own CHAdeMO adapter for their cars. Its becoming more and more popular. How can they ignore this? I know about the risk of high voltage = no charge, case.
I only see CHAdeMO as the viable option, because it charges so fast that you can stop, eat a 50 min. lunch and then continue your journey. No other chargers are fast enough for this.
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Here is the response I got from ABB.
We have delivered fastchargers to the Zero Factory in USA and know that they work. Charge time is 30-60min depending on the batterypack and the temperature.
"The CHAdeMO protocol in the EU and the US is the same. Maybe there is a small difference in the cable (UL certified or CE certified) but the connector will fit and the protocol is the same.
ABB Terra charges are CHAdeMO 0.9 and 1.0 certified, so there is no problem to be expected with the protocol version.
One remark: Please note that the battery voltage of a motorcycle is in general lower than the battery voltage of a car. If this is the case, the charger will not be able to deliver full output power. The output current is limited to 120A, so for 50kW output a voltage of at least 416V is required."
Best regards
Arne Sigbjornsen
Local PG Manager EV Charging Infrastructure
ABB AS
Charging Infrastructure
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Feel free to contact Zero directly about wanting a CHAdeMO and be sure to communicate to them that you understand it will not be compatible with all CHAdeMO stations and you still want it.
I got a 2014 specifically for CHAdeMO capability and they have not and will not make a kit for 2014 Zeros. There are some CHAdeMO kits on some 2013 bikes, but they will not supply any more for those either.
All good points being made on this forum. Fast charging is the only way forward (Tesla already figured this out), and Zero needs to provide a fast charging solution for mass adoption. Right now as a company they feel like they have been burned by the CHAdeMO stations and have retreated. I hope they figure out fast charging soon, as I desperately want it. Desperately!
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Fast charging is CRITICAL in terms of making any electric bike an all rounder capable of doing 250+ mile runs.
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@zero, if the chademo chargers won't give you 96-118vdc, can you maybe drop 250vdc to 96-118vdc????????? http://www.absopulse.com/Absopulse_DC_DC_Converters.php (http://www.absopulse.com/Absopulse_DC_DC_Converters.php)
Having just been convinced by the good doc that it's legal to charge our batteries with a straight CC-CV scheme, this seems like a very promising avenue. Provided the DC-DC converter can operate in CC mode for an extended period, it should be fairly simple to plug into a CHAdeMO station with some simple electronics that says "I need 250VDC at no more than 50A", and then down-convert it with an appropriate DC-DC converter to ~115VDC with a current limit of no more than 100A. Done.
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Your right most AC switch mode power supplies (SMPS) can run off high voltage DC (you dont need seperate DC to DC), It just means it be using 2 out of the 4 rectifying diodes, so as long as the 2 diodes can handle full load it should be good. IF we can get CHdeMO to supply the high Voltage DC to use instead of high voltage AC, It may be even more efficient with higher voltage than 110VAC/230VAC.
Hope fully can use our existing meanwells , Elcons, (cheap server powersupplys, etc)
DocBass use same technique using cheap laptop style AC to DC power supplies powered from 116DC from battery pack to generate 13.8VDC 10A for zero bikes instead of buying the expensive ZERO 12V DC kit.
Below is from wiki pedia
"If the SMPS has an AC input, then the first stage is to convert the input to DC. This is called rectification. A SMPS with a DC input does not require this stage."
"A SMPS designed for AC input can usually be run from a DC supply, because the DC would pass through the rectifier unchanged. If the power supply is designed for 115 VAC and has no voltage selector switch, the required DC voltage would be 163 VDC (115 × √2). This type of use may be harmful to the rectifier stage, however, as it will only use half of diodes in the rectifier for the full load. This could possibly result in overheating of these components, causing them to fail prematurely. On the other hand, if the power supply has a voltage selector switch for 115/230V (computer ATX power supplies typically are in this category), the selector switch would have to be put in the 230 V position, and the required voltage would be 325 VDC (230 × √2). The diodes in this type of power supply will handle the DC current just fine because they are rated to handle double the nominal input current when operated in the 115 V mode, due to the operation of the voltage doubler. This is because the doubler, when in operation, uses only half of the bridge rectifier and runs twice as much current through it. It is uncertain how an Auto-ranging/Active-PFC type power supply would react to being powered by DC."
To upgrade the rectifying diodes is simple just replace the 4 diodes (or diode bridge)with higher voltage/current specs if needed.
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I'd be a little concerned about using an AC power supply, firepower. It will certainly work in the situation you describe, where the PS has a rectifier bridge and capacitor filtering right on the front end, but I don't know that that's always the case with these mega-power supplies these days. Some of them use "active rectification", i.e. MOSFETs instead of diodes, and some include "active power factor correction", other electronics in front of the rectifiers to reduce the switching junk directed back onto the line. Active rectifiers might have the problem you describe, where you're only using two of the four devices, so they overheat, and power factor correcting circuitry could go haywire in all sorts of ways.
I think it's fine to use that technique on cheap, low-power supplies, like doc does, but I'd be reluctant to try it on a 1kW+ piece of highly-engineered equipment.
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Feel free to contact Zero directly about wanting a CHAdeMO and be sure to communicate to them that you understand it will not be compatible with all CHAdeMO stations and you still want it.
I got a 2014 specifically for CHAdeMO capability and they have not and will not make a kit for 2014 Zeros. There are some CHAdeMO kits on some 2013 bikes, but they will not supply any more for those either.
All good points being made on this forum. Fast charging is the only way forward (Tesla already figured this out), and Zero needs to provide a fast charging solution for mass adoption. Right now as a company they feel like they have been burned by the CHAdeMO stations and have retreated. I hope they figure out fast charging soon, as I desperately want it. Desperately!
Have sent all the sales/support departments a couple of mails. Never got any response. But when I get in contact with anyone, they just say that they dont sell them any more. Agree, fast charging is the way to go. I really hope they figure it out soon too. But we need 0-100% charging under 1 hour.
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http://shop.quickchargepower.com/ (http://shop.quickchargepower.com/)
I wonder what would prevent their RAV4 CHAdeMO solution from working on the Zeros.
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I wonder what would prevent their RAV4 CHAdeMO solution from working on the Zeros.
Checked it out the FAQs and it seems like they keep the information fairly close to the vest.
Only their prior approved technicians or some Toyota dealerships can install the kit.
Probably not too likely for customization in DIY fashion for Zeros (or others).
It seems that some in the dealer network might see a potential market here for $$$ technician work.
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And if Quick Charge Power hasn't been paying attention, someone should let them know that there's an eager market with the Electric Motorcycle enthusiasts, and they could quickly grow their customer base and revenues with some focus this way.
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have also asked about feeding SMPS with DC at eevblog.
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/powering-ac-smps-from-hv-dc/ (http://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/powering-ac-smps-from-hv-dc/)
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Another option may be for everyone who really wants a CHAdeMO kit for their Zero to contact Harlan at Hollywood Electrics about it. If there is enough interest to make the development worth it then Harlan might be willing to build CHAdeMO kits.
http://hollywoodelectrics.com/ (http://hollywoodelectrics.com/)
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That thought occurred to me yesterday. Will check in with Harlan about it soon. I know he feels that fast charging will be the way to go eventually, but am not sure what technical hurdles exist.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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http://shop.quickchargepower.com/ (http://shop.quickchargepower.com/)
I wonder what would prevent their RAV4 CHAdeMO solution from working on the Zeros.
The QC vehicle-side would need to be customized to talk to the vehicle BMS, as well as asking for a safe input voltage and current for the batteries given installed capacity, SOC, age, cell temperature, etc.
It would likely be much easier for them to make the RAV4 QC talk to the MB B-class than the Zeros, for example. I would expect that to be the second vehicle they support, if there is interest.
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Speaking of fast charging, Ted (you know who he is, right ;) ) has just published this article on his web site. It shows an Energica Ego getting some fast electrons at a charging station: http://insideevs.com/energica-ego-fast-charge-video/ (http://insideevs.com/energica-ego-fast-charge-video/)
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There are a number of inflection points in the electric motorcycle industry. IMHO.
2008 Brammo Enertia was the first "mass-production" electric. Not the first electric motorcycle, but the first built with the intent of mass production rather than one-off assembly.
2012 Zero S ZF9 was the first "long range" production electric. 100+ miles in city riding.
2015 Energica Ego is the first "quick charge" production electric. 20 kW DC, claiming 3 miles per minute [in city riding].
CCS is still rare on the ground in the US, but it's picking up speed in both the US and Europe. Presumably, the traditional manufacturers tinker with prototypes while waiting for EV technology and demand to reach a tipping point; similarly, Zero is tinkering with fast charging and ~100V electrics while waiting for quick charge infrastructure to reach a tipping point.
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Greenlots is installing a lot of dual CHAdeMO/CCS chargers in North Carolina, Virginia, and South Carolina. There are now enough that I could travel around NC with CCS. But heading north will be a challenge as CHAdeMO still rules.
With Zero canceling CHAdeMO the Ego is getting a second look.
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This caught my attention: Cycle World magazine in their May 2015 issue published a two-page article regarding the 2015 Zero line (interestingly, they didn't care much for the handling of the S/SR models but preferred the DS model, instead) . In a sidebar to the article, they show the "Energica Ego 45" as costing $68,000 USD! At that price (if it is correct), you would expect CHAdeMO and a lot more. ::) They also showed (as competing brands for the Zero) the Lightning at $38,000 and the LiveWire at a price to be determined.
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The Ego is a little over 30 Euro. So I assume also between 30 and 40k US $
The Ego 45 is a limited edition.
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Do someone know this guy? He convert BMWs into EVs and added Chademo to a 5-series. I just sent him a message if he can do this for the Zero, too
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The majority of Dc chargers in Holland, and I think in Europe, are from ABB and Efacec. These support 50-500VDC, so these should be able to charge a 'low voltage' Zero battery
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In a sidebar to the article, they show the "Energica Ego 45" as costing $68,000 USD! At that price (if it is correct), you would expect CHAdeMO and a lot more. ::) They also showed (as competing brands for the Zero) the Lightning at $38,000 and the LiveWire at a price to be determined.
The Energica Ego is being advertised in the US for $34,000 and it includes CCS charging, not ChaDeMo. (CCS is what the BMW i3 uses and what Volkswagen & Chevy plan to use in the future).
Lecram, please let us know if you can find someone who can make a ChaDeMo adapter for us!
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The majority of Dc chargers in Holland, and I think in Europe, are from ABB and Efacec. These support 50-500VDC, so these should be able to charge a 'low voltage' Zero battery
Yes they do, ABB have tested all their chargers with the Zero bikes. I would SO hope Zero would open their eyes for this. I will tell everyone that asks me about my bike that it does not have any fastcharge before Zero gets their finger out and produce CHAdeMO sets for us with Zero SR again. It makes me horribly sad. It limits my use of the bike quite a lot. Please, please Zero, listen to us customers. Make CHAdeMO sets! If we know that a few stations are not compatible I dont see the problem.
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I think the only hope of seeing CHAdeMO for a Zero motorcycle is through Hollywood Electrics or some other after market company. http://hollywoodelectrics.com/ (http://hollywoodelectrics.com/) Maybe we all need to start talking to Harlan about this. For example Hollywood Electrics sells L2 Charging systems for Zeros and while I love mine I also know it doesn't work on all L2 systems out there such as GE Wattstations and PEP systems. If Harlan builds a CHAdeMO for Zero it isn't going to work on Blink and Aerovironment systems. For me and many others on this forum that isn't a big deal either. Harlan is obviously willing to take risk on the L2 systems so I would hope he would feel the same way on L3 systems. Zero clearly isn't which is also why I don't see Zero ever coming out with L2 charging for Zero motorcycles.
Joar79, I know exactly how you feel. I live in North Carolina and the CHAdeMO systems here would work with a Zero as will most on the east coast of the US.
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The majority of Dc chargers in Holland, and I think in Europe, are from ABB and Efacec. These support 50-500VDC, so these should be able to charge a 'low voltage' Zero battery
Yes they do, ABB have tested all their chargers with the Zero bikes. ...
Which interface did they use? The elusive Zero prototype?