ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: kodek on March 25, 2015, 11:45:33 AM
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Hi everyone,
I learned about the Zero bikes a few months ago, and I've been obsessed ever since. I signed up for a motorcycle safety class this weekend, and I'm very excited to start riding :)
I was wondering what your opinions were on starting out with a Zero SR. While I like the entire Zero line-up, I feel that if I commit to purchasing an electric motorcycle, I will shortly after regret not having gone with the top-of-the-line bike. Although I am not looking to commute on the bike at first, I'd like to leave that open as a possibility; the lower end bikes don't have the range for my long commute. On the other hand, I feel that a complete beginner with a $20k bike in LA traffic is a recipe for disaster (even if I use the torque limiting functionality).
What do you guys think?
Thank you!
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I personally think the zero sr is the perfect beginner bike. Its one of the easiest safest bikes to ride and will have enough power to keep you very happy as your riding skills develop. No need to trade it in for more power later, which is what petrol bike riding is like.
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I got a Zero S 11.4 as my first bike, for this exact reason (SR wasn't available yet). I didn't want to buy a 250 and be tired of it in a month, then be looking for something else. I wanted to buy something that would last me a while. I rode for about the first 2 months with the bike limited to 40% (which is still plenty fast for a beginner), and then increased the power as I became more confident of a rider. I still haven't had the opportunity to ride the SR, but going into my second season I couldn't be happier with the S, and I don't see myself getting bored of it anytime soon.
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It would be a great first bike except for the fact you are likely to drop the first bike...almost guaranteed during the first year. Although the fantastic throttle control will help avoid some of those slow speed maneuvering problems in parking lots, there are still a lot of things that can go wrong...hitting the front brake in a very slow speed turn, not getting the kick stand all the way down, balance issues, putting your foot down on loose sand, just moving the bike by hand, etc. etc. Usually, the first bike should be a used bike like a Ninja or CBR 250. They are cheap, easily repaired, and hold their value. There are also a lot of almost new bikes for sale where someone decided after a short time that riding was not for them. I'd go for a cheap, beater bike.
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My first response, as a 14-month SR owner, was that the SR would be a great first bike. Electrics are so much easier to operate, so much smoother and predictable overall, that you don't have nearly as many skills to learn as you would on an ICE bike. The power of the SR isn't a problem -- there's no rule that you have to twist the throttle all the way to the stop.
But dkw makes a great point. Until you become truly facile with a motorcycle, your odds of dropping the bike are pretty high, almost invariably at low speed rather than high speed -- speaking for myself, I dropped my first bike twice before I became really confident on it. Motorcycles are like bicycles in that they're quite stable once you're up to speed, with the steering geometry working for you and the wheels contributing gyroscopic inertia, but they can be a handful at low speeds where you don't have either advantage. A truly skilled rider can wait his turn at a stop sign at very low speeds without putting a foot down or wobbling from side to side. That kind of skill takes a while to develop.
After thinking it through, I think I'm going to have to side with dkw. You really ought to think hard about learning on a less expensive, lighter, more agile machine, and look at it as an opportunity to see what becomes available in 2016, as your riding skills are developing. There's good reason bikes like that are considered beginner bikes.
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Dropping close to $20k on your first bike is a bad idea, no matter how easy it is to ride. Get something cheap that you won't worry about dropping, learn the basic functions and if you get bored, move on. Also, the idea that you're going to want to keep your first bike for a long time is far from guaranteed. Maybe you will, maybe you'll want to try something else, but now you're stuck with a bike that's probably depreciated pretty substantially. If your current bike lust is strong, it could mean your future bike lust (for a different bike model) could be just as strong. Take your time.
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I got a used CBR 250 as my first bike and sold it half a year later for the same price. During that time, I practiced slow speed maneuvers in empty parking lots almost every time I rode it, knowing that it was OK to drop it, and I did a few times. I'm glad I did. Plus, you'll really like the feel of your Zero once you switch!
That being said though, the Zero handles very differently than an ICE bike at low speed so you'll have to readjust, but you'll get used to it quickly.
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Fx or xu maybe as first bike
Sr no way
No one mentioned whiskey throttle.... Much much easier to loose an electric bike than a gas bike; especially as a novice rider, I watched my brother break his ribs first time he got I my 22
2012 mx
The fx will take the "lay" down much better than the heavy sr, s or ds.
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I concur with most of the posts above. Go light, cheap and IC until you get your riding legs under you. After a year or two or riding you will have enough experience to decide what is the best vehicle for you in the future. :)
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I signed up for a motorcycle safety class this weekend, ...
You beat me to it. :D
Single most important decision, regardless of what you ride. So many guys who are coming at it as electric motorcycle enthusiasts, rather than motorcycle enthusiasts, seem to miss this part.
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You'll love it and will grow into it as a rider. With the eco and custom modes you can take it easy and carefully to begin with, then gradually work your way into the power. You won't need to deal with buying and selling other bikes, so long as you keep this one safe and upright. Find some old riders who seem overly safe and do exactly what they tell you to.
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First post! I've been stalking here for a while. Here's my 2 cents... If you are flush with cash and can afford an SR as your first bike, GO FOR IT! You will probably be able to afford to replace bent and broken pieces when you dump it. If you are going to be financing this bike for 10 years and making minimum payments, you may want to consider going the inexpensive ICE bike route and waiting. I hear big changes are coming with the 2016's. It could be beneficial to wait and see.
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I think it is possible to start with an SR but I would still listen to the caveats listed above. I myself returned to motorcycling last year after a 30 year hiatus. My strategy was to start with something easy to ride so I bought a scooter to get the feel of two wheels. Just being out in traffic again on a motorbike took a while to get used to. Once I got my legs under me I pulled the trigger on the SR. Did I ever drop the scooter? Yep - low speed turn on a steep driveway. Fortunately no real damage except for the extreme embarrassment and the difficulty in picking up a 420 lb scooter on a slope. As soon as I got the SR I practiced low speed maneuvering as much as I could - a lot of it at the local DMV after hours where I ran the motorcycle test course over and over again until it got it perfect every time. I still go back occasionally to zig-zag the cones and do the tight circle - it's fun to whip through it now. For those of you that haven't done that for a while I would advise trying it to see how you do. My SR is just about at steering lock in the circle so there's not much room for correction if you get off line. I must say though that an electric bike is VERY easy to modulate at low speeds so in that respect it can be a great beginner bike.
If you do go for the Zero straightaway you need to practice, practice, practice in a safe area. This is obvious but you have to be very careful in full power mode - you will use it and soon - it's inevitable. As Cortezdtv mentioned above, whiskey throttle on an SR in Sport Mode would not be pretty. Take the safety course, watch riding tutorials on YouTube, learn about countersteering, talk to other riders - do everything you can to add to your knowledge and experience. There is no substitute for seat time in all conditions. Take baby steps. There is a tight turn near my house that I was terrified to take at more than 30 mph when I first got my SR. I now take it at 36-37 mph but I worked up to that very slowly over 3 months time. Above all, ride well within your limits and stay under control. Going beyond what you are capable of can put you on the ground or off the road or worse in a split second. Don't ask me how I know. And ATGATT (All The Gear, All The Time). This is a personal choice but I firmly believe in it. Good luck with whatever you choose.
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Have you considered a used Enertia which can be had for around $3000 off craigslist or ebay. An older Zero might be a good choice as well, depending on what is available. This will still get you an electric, but won't hurt so much when it gets its first scratch. Also, they tend to be a bit more modest in performance which might keep you out of trouble while you are still learning.
An advantage to a small ICE bike is you will learn how to use the clutch and it will be similar to what you use in a skills class. Don't think of it as you are going to outgrow it, think of it as you get to sell the one you just put a bunch of scratches in for almost the same price you paid. The reason you hear people saying you will probably drop your first bike is because we ALL dropped ours a few times when learning.
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I hear big changes are coming with the 2016's. It could be beneficial to wait and see.
I know it's probably rumors, but has anything semi-official been said? I'd love to wait, but as far as I know, the 2015s were released in December, and I wouldn't want to wait that long. :)
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I learned about the Zero bikes a few months ago, and I've been obsessed ever since. I signed up for a motorcycle safety class this weekend, and I'm very excited to start riding :)
I also have been obsessed with the Zero bikes since I saw them last year! I was waiting for the ABS and now they have that. I am still trying to sell my current bike so I can get the Zero but thinking of maybe waiting for the 2016's. I think that it would be a great bike to start with, with the only exception being the price. I must say it is true you WILL drop your first bike, I dropped my Ninja 250 when I stopped on an uneven incline. Luckily it was on my own street and did not do any real damage just scuffed the clutch lever and shifter. Wow was the embarrassing, but it seems to be inevitable for most of us.
My main thing was that I hated to shift, so right away knew that wasn't for me. I bought a cheap 150cc automatic Chinese motorcycle to learn on and got comfortable riding on the streets. (Picture posted below of Chinese bike) I also took the MSF course last June and used the Chinese motorcycle to test on so I would not have to shift at all. Once I completed the course I sold that bike and moved up to the Aprilia Mana which is also an automatic but a lot bigger engine displacement at 850cc's. I really like the Mana but want a Zero since it is about 100lbs lighter than my current bike and love the fact that you just plug and drive.
If you go and decide on the Zero just do as others have said, practice, practice, practice. I road my Chinese bike around the block for close to 50 miles before I took it out on the main roads. Just make sure you go at your own speed and don't feel the need to rush. I'm glad I did it the way that I did, and now feel very comfortable out on the roads, but of course not too comfortable... you always have to be aware! As I heard a lot once I started riding, act like everyone is out to get you and you definitely pay more attention out on the road.
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I hear big changes are coming with the 2016's. It could be beneficial to wait and see.
I know it's probably rumors, but has anything semi-official been said? I'd love to wait, but as far as I know, the 2015s were released in December, and I wouldn't want to wait that long. :)
Would love to know the answer to this also. But thinking of just waiting and save up more money so less to finance! They only seem to improve each year and even if nothing great is added or modified I can get a little bit of money off of the "last year model."
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On the other hand, I feel that a complete beginner with a $20k bike in LA traffic is a recipe for disaster
Living in LA you must hate traffic now not having had the ability to split lanes and be free from it yet. Get your motorcycle license and definitely get an electric motorcycle, so you don't have to use a clutch and shift in LA traffic. You may not want to split lanes at first and stop and go for twenty miles will be murder with a clutch.
But do you get a new Zero or a used one? I agree you will probably fall over once in your first year. Luckily the Zero's crash quite well and usually only the bar end gets scuffed on the left side and the brake lever bent on the right. This is thanks to the steering locks that prevent the plastics from touching the ground I guess. Since you're in LA I would stop by Hollywood Electrics at 901 N Fairfax in West Hollywood and see what he thinks. He might have a used 2013 or 2014 S to start on, or as long as it is insured, maybe just get the new one with ABS brakes. You never know when these might be the difference between injury or not. When I started riding I didn't have ABS as an option. I wish I had.
Now that I think about it. Get a 2015 Zero with ABS. Period.
There is no price you can put on your safety. And the ABS as a new rider in crazy LA traffic is worth it.
S or SR is up to you. I would recommend the S to start so you're not tempted to get yourself into too much trouble right away. The S is plenty fast on its own. Harlan from Hollywood Electrics can always upgrade it to an SR later.
Or get the SR and promise yourself you won't take it out of Eco mode for at least 2 months! Seriously! Not even to try it in a parking lot! (ok well maybe in an empty parking lot, but that's it!)
Give us an update with your new purchase and tell us how it is!
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Or get the SR and promise yourself you won't take it out of Eco mode for at least 2 months!
Hmm...he might make 2 hours...maybe.
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I dunno, when I was riding the 2013 DS which Zero lent me while my 2012 was being fixed, I managed to keep it in Eco mode most of the time.
Mostly because I realised how much more powerful it was, and did'nt want to be too dissapointed in the drop in power when I got the 2012 back... ;)
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I came back to biking and bought an Aprillia Shiver 750. I dropped it twice but didn't damage it much. I'm glad I got a bike with a decent amount of power.
Just by the fact that you've posted here tells me you're a sensible person who isn't going to go hell for leather the moment you jump on it.
Even the biggest bikes like the ZZR 1400 are very easy to control. They have to be. I don't think you'll have any problem regulating the power and exploring the throttle as you get comfortable. Keep in mind some of the ways people have described dropping their bikes and hopefully you won't have to learn the hard way. Take it steady and at your own pace and you'll have a bike you can ride easily from the start. It will keep rewarding you as you get more in tune with it.
With powerful bikes you get bigger tyres, better brakes, better suspension and so on. That means they're safer in my opinion. Being able to make overtakes quickly and effortlessly is a big safety factor too.
If you go for the S or equivalent ICE bike you'll find it's limits within weeks. Even with my 750 it didn't take long. If you're buying the bike to have fun, you don't want to be opening the throttle to the stop and thinking 'Is that it?' You want to know there's always some more and that when you get there you'll be riding close to the limits of your ability, always bearing safety in mind too of course.
That's how I've found my current bike, a Fazer 1000. I wish I'd got it first even though the 750 was a really nice bike.
Now I'm stepping down to a Honda NC750. Less powerful than the Shiver. That's only because 95% of my miles are my commute. I need to compromise a bit because I've realized I can't justify the initial cost of a Zero at the moment and I don't want to maintain an ICE bike just for the rare opportunities I get to go for longer runs. Otherwise I'd have a Zero SR in a heartbeat.
Get the SR. You won't regret it unless it proves to be unreliable. IMHO there is no risk of losing control unless you ride it like a hooligan. Take your time, use your noddle and you're unlikely to drop it either. Life's too short to faff around if there's no need to.
Just remember to post here and let us all know how you're getting on. I will eat my hat if getting the SR doesn't work out well for you! [emoji4]