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Author Topic: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS  (Read 3254 times)

CliC

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2012, 05:36:54 AM »

LMAO!  He rides it like he's bowlegged, which can't be good for wind resistance (or comfort should he need to punch the brakes and keep himself from slamming forward), and then when he "leans" into a corner with what looks like a whopping 20 degree lean angle (that's 20 degrees from vertical, not 20 degrees from the road), the leg comes out and he leans his body as if it's straining the limits of physics.

Ummm... Where did he learn to "ride"?

He's hanging off, like superbike racers (and some wanna-be racers) do. Guess he was worried about those "$3 Chinese tires". On my DS, those Deli-Tires have held at more severe lean angles than what he was doing. I've never felt the need to hang off. Then again, I've never owned a sportbike, so hanging off is not something I do automatically.

I gotta say, though, that I kinda like that Piaggio scooter :) May have to talk the g/f into one ;)

The funniest thing for me is that he intentionally drains the battery and then gets pissed that it strands him on the side of an interstate. Which only tells me that the real shocking truth about electric motorcyces is that they do not necessarily make their riders any smarter :)
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oobflyer

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2012, 05:38:19 AM »

If he'd followed the manufacturer's recommendation of plugging in, while he was drinking beer and bashing the bike, he wouldn't have run out of energy on the freeway.

Duh
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2021 Energica Ribelle, 2015 Zero SR, 2012 Zero ZF9, 2007 Vectrix VX-1 Li+, 2012 Nissan Leaf, 2018 Nissan Leaf, 2020 Nissan Leaf, 2018 Tesla Model 3, 2023 Tesla Model Y

rotoiti

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2012, 06:24:23 AM »

Heh, for a fresh video (the viewcount still hasn't updated yet) having 74 dislikes vs. 209 likes just speaks for itself. Only Justin Bieber does worse ;-)
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Richard230

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2012, 06:46:32 AM »

I thought it was a nice touch that he peed into the LA freeway landscaping and that they went out of their way to show that illegal deed.  That guy is a real jerk and his antics, such as swearing and flipping his audience the bird at the end of the video, does nothing to get his message across (such as it is).  However, I do agree that the Piaggio scooter looked nice.
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

flar

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2012, 01:43:13 PM »

LMAO!  He rides it like he's bowlegged, which can't be good for wind resistance (or comfort should he need to punch the brakes and keep himself from slamming forward), and then when he "leans" into a corner with what looks like a whopping 20 degree lean angle (that's 20 degrees from vertical, not 20 degrees from the road), the leg comes out and he leans his body as if it's straining the limits of physics.

Ummm... Where did he learn to "ride"?
He's hanging off, like superbike racers (and some wanna-be racers) do.

Well, yes, I knew what he thought he was doing.  But, at those lean angles?  They lean off because they are reaching the edge of their tires and possibly on a street bike because you are reaching the point where you will start dragging hardware. The bike can't lean any more, but you can move over and shift the CoG without leaning the bike past its limit.

But him?  Why was he doing it?  Cuz it lookz kewl?  Overall, everything he was doing was just sloppy riding with a hint of "whee, look at me, I'm a hot shot racer dude!"

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Guess he was worried about those "$3 Chinese tires". On my DS, those Deli-Tires have held at more severe lean angles than what he was doing.

Even the cheapest tires can hold a lean angle way past what he was showing.  And if they are reaching their limit, then hanging off doesn't reduce the G forces, it just changes where the contact patch delivers them from, so again, sloppy riding.

Quote
I've never felt the need to hang off. Then again, I've never owned a sportbike, so hanging off is not something I do automatically.

Neither have I, though in a Dual Sport clinic the instructor once made the case for reverse leaning (at low speeds having to do with using the camber of the tire to turn a tighter corner than it would if it was in line with your body).  We tried it as part of the exercise.  It was an interesting effect, but not something I bother with in practice (though I did use the technique to help scrub some brand new tires a couple of weeks ago - ride on a part of the tire that wouldn't normally be scuffed at lower G forces than it would normally take to scuff them).

Also, the knee going out has more to do with feeling for the angle of the road than weight transfer.  The weight of the leg isn't going to change the CoG angle much, but riding the puck around the apex gives a really accurate feel for just how near the limit you are getting.  But, again, that only works if you are, ahem, close enough to the road for your knee to actually reach it.

Quote
I gotta say, though, that I kinda like that Piaggio scooter :) May have to talk the g/f into one ;)

It looks like a great ride.  I was also a little annoyed with how they dramatized the scooter passing him - mainly because he wasn't riding the Zero very hard in the first place <face palm>.  I have a friend with an old beater scooter that she bought off her daughter that died its last gasp.  I'll have to point her in the direction of the Piaggios.

Quote
The funniest thing for me is that he intentionally drains the battery and then gets pissed that it strands him on the side of an interstate. Which only tells me that the real shocking truth about electric motorcyces is that they do not necessarily make their riders any smarter :)

My impression was not that he was pissed that it ran out of power, but that he was being melodramatic about the experience of "suddenly losing power" on the highway.  Seriously?  That happened to me on my test ride and I actually wrote on the comment form that it was a very positive experience since I was very pleased by how benign and well communicated its gradual loss of power was.  It was as if a butler came along and told me "Excuse me sir, but we should gradually make our way over to an exit some time in the next few miles, if it is not too properly inconvenient, and our apologies for any inconvenience".

But, for him, "I don't want to talk right now, I'm really scared [gulps]".  Really?  Scared speechless?  Over the gradual loss of power over the course of several miles?  All I can say is "Yay!"...
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Currently riding: 2013 Brammo Empulse R, 2005 BMW R1200RT
Used to ride: '88 Hawk GT, '97 BMW F650 Funduro
Other electric motorcycles test ridden: 2012 Zero S/DS, Brammo Empulse R, 2013 Zero S, Energica Ego/Eva
Other EV own: Tesla Model X
Other EV test drives: Tesla Roadster/S/3

protomech

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2012, 08:57:16 PM »

Here's a snippet of the exchange on Hell For Leather..

Devin | May 7, 2012 7:55 PM | Reply
I was surprised to see you riding so conservatively, even I hit it harder than that, and I don’t ride hard. So those $3 tires must really be $3 tires.

Wes Siler | May 7, 2012 8:44 PM | Reply
Remember there’s a chase truck I’m behind too. They didn’t much like me wizzing off into the distance. The point here is to tell a compelling story, not to stroke my ego.

Grant Ray | May 7, 2012 11:19 PM | Reply
(He totally wizzed off into the distance and got yelled at for doing so.)
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dkw12002

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2012, 02:37:36 AM »

I think the BV350 tops out at 86 mph, not over 100 mph like he said.
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CliC

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2012, 04:26:01 AM »

Sorry, flar, didn't mean to insult your intelligence. I really know nothing about the whole hanging-off thing, though your explanation of doing it for cornering limit feel vs. actually getting the bike to stick better makes sense.

Melodramatic is about the size of it. I'd be really surprised if that e-mag of his made any money. I wouldn't subscribe after reading and watching all this.
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flar

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2012, 06:29:48 AM »

No problem, Clic, I wasn't offended.  I just thought that maybe I had crafted my point a little too cryptically close to sarcasm to make the points I was getting at...
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Currently riding: 2013 Brammo Empulse R, 2005 BMW R1200RT
Used to ride: '88 Hawk GT, '97 BMW F650 Funduro
Other electric motorcycles test ridden: 2012 Zero S/DS, Brammo Empulse R, 2013 Zero S, Energica Ego/Eva
Other EV own: Tesla Model X
Other EV test drives: Tesla Roadster/S/3

Richard230

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2012, 06:32:20 AM »

And for those of you who might have an interest in the Piaggio X10 350i scooter, here is a review by Ultimate Motorcycling:

http://www.ultimatemotorcycling.com/2012-piaggio-x10-350i-scooter-review
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

oobflyer

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2012, 10:45:54 PM »

Comparing the Electric bike to a gas bike is stupid. If he wanted to compare he should have compared it to another electric bike.

That's like saying the gas scooter fails because you can't plug it into the outlet in your garage.

His obvious immaturity should exclude his reviews from being taken seriously.
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2021 Energica Ribelle, 2015 Zero SR, 2012 Zero ZF9, 2007 Vectrix VX-1 Li+, 2012 Nissan Leaf, 2018 Nissan Leaf, 2020 Nissan Leaf, 2018 Tesla Model 3, 2023 Tesla Model Y

Nukie

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2012, 05:01:44 AM »

I finally got a chance to watch the video review. I have to agree with you all about this guy not being the brightest bulb in the headlight. If you pause the video where his bike stalls out at the end and they show the instrument panel, it appears from the toggle he was riding the entire time in Sport mode. It's no wonder he got such poor range.
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Lipo423

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2012, 12:24:36 AM »

Well, very little to add after you comments guys...I have read few vehicle reviews in my life as bad as this one (and I read quite a few already).

As a European, and having to pay today gas at $2-$2,5/litrer -yes, per litre, not gallon...you do find a lot of good reasons -and a way- to ride a non perfect electric and rather expensive motorcycle.  What it really piss me off (just to set the same tone he does)is the fact that this is not a gas bike -this summarizes everything- and trying to compare a Zero 9 series with a gas bike, is like comparing the "practical use" an SR-71 Blackbird with a Boeing 747  >:(

Anyway, opinions are like "bottoms" everyone has one...

I apologize for my wording.
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protomech

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2012, 12:41:45 AM »

I apologize for my wording.

No need to apologize.

BTW, speaking of Euro prices for gasoline.. I wonder if anyone has done a total cost of ownership comparison with a small gas bike.

Something like this:
http://www.empulsebuyer.com/tcoCalculator.php?sTR=4&fTR=0&sTI=NA&eID=9&kWhC=0.08&eRng=70&bR=0&iceID=7&msrp=4199&gC=4&mpg=55&oCC=40&oCI=7500&sC=550&sI=15000

I get 97k miles break-even when I punch in my parameters ($4/gal gas, $0.085/kWh, 70 mile range ZF9, 55 mpg 250), which matches my estimate of 100k miles over 10 years. I doubt the Ninja 250 can make 100k miles, but of course I don't know the Zero chassis or battery will make 10 years / 100k either.

If I just punch in $9/gal gas, I get a 52k mile break-even point.. but I know Euro purchase price, taxes, electricity, service costs will be rather different as well.
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Lipo423

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Re: Wired Magazine Reviews the Zero DS
« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2012, 03:10:52 AM »

Thanks protomech.

The Kw/h cost in Spain is around 0,16 Euro/Kw taxes included (18% VAT). Our lovely government will raise the prices soon...
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Bikes: Kawa GPX 600, Suzuki GSX 750-R, Yamaha FZR 1000, Suzuki Lido 75, Peugeot SV 125, Suzuki Burgman 400, Suzuki Burgman 650, KTM EXC 250, 2012 Zero ZF9 - All of them sold -
2014 Zero SR 11.4, BMW C1 125, BMW R 850R
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